Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

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Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by wams747 » October 8th, 2017, 10:16 am

I am so done with Myers it is ridiculous! He is THE problem.

Offensive talent may not be fantastic but we know Tarver can be a weapon, Dax is the best tight end in the Mountain West (probably), the O-line has improved a lot over last year, Nathan has shown flashes, although far from great I think even Hunt and Allen could be VERY serviceable if we had any semblance of an offense that could consistently move the ball (the COMPLETE ineptitude of our passing game because of Myers is what makes us not have a running game).

I want to start chanting and its another Myers 3 and out. Every single Aggie I talk to is so done with him. The only thing he has been good at this year against half decent competition is taking a sack. For those that listened to Aggie call I whole heartedly agree with the hosts and believe that the majority of those sacks were not on the O-line or "coverage sacks." It is Myers complete lack of an ability to go through progressions, have a clock in his head, or even look like he has any clue out there. He can't make a decision so he just curls up in the fetal position to tack a sack.

Kent "Take a Sack" Myers, at least he is VERY stingy with the ball and doesn't turn it over.... oh wait he has a 1:1 TD to INT ratio.

Referring to the offense my wife said it is a long way to drive when it is not even fun to watch. (We live in the SL area).

I am a loyal and long-time Aggie and pretty close to never leave early. I drove to San Diego after the Boise win in 2015 and never even thought about leaving early with the butt whooping they put on us and I can say the same for the one they put on us last year in Logan in the rain. But for the first time this offense is making me want to leave early and do something fun. (I know I won't miss Wells giving Love a chance cuz he won't do that in a million years) I mean a REAL chance! Not one series in which Love looked good and did Nothing wrong but his first down pass was dropped after hitting the receiver in the hands.

Wells inability to decide to stop trotting out an INEFFECTIVE QB even after 3 straight 3 and outs, or pick 6's, or garbage time or whatever else is becoming the biggest reason I don't think Wells should continue as our coach.

For those that may not think Love is the answer. Go with DJ at least the dude has some competitive drive and heart. Or pull Colombi's redshirt, or let Hobbs run a wildcat or whatever. NOTHING can be worse than what we are seeing and we already know what we have in Myers!



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by aceofspadeskb » October 8th, 2017, 10:24 am

wams747 wrote:I am so done with Myers it is ridiculous! He is THE problem.

Offensive talent may not be fantastic but we know Tarver can be a weapon, Dax is the best tight end in the Mountain West (probably), the O-line has improved a lot over last year, Nathan has shown flashes, although far from great I think even Hunt and Allen could be VERY serviceable if we had any semblance of an offense that could consistently move the ball (the COMPLETE ineptitude of our passing game because of Myers is what makes us not have a running game).

I want to start chanting and its another Myers 3 and out. Every single Aggie I talk to is so done with him. The only thing he has been good at this year against half decent competition is taking a sack. For those that listened to Aggie call I whole heartedly agree with the hosts and believe that the majority of those sacks were not on the O-line or "coverage sacks." It is Myers complete lack of an ability to go through progressions, have a clock in his head, or even look like he has any clue out there. He can't make a decision so he just curls up in the fetal position to tack a sack.

Kent "Take a Sack" Myers, at least he is VERY stingy with the ball and doesn't turn it over.... oh wait he has a 1:1 TD to INT ratio.

Referring to the offense my wife said it is a long way to drive when it is not even fun to watch. (We live in the SL area).

I am a loyal and long-time Aggie and pretty close to never leave early. I drove to San Diego after the Boise win in 2015 and never even thought about leaving early with the butt whooping they put on us and I can say the same for the one they put on us last year in Logan in the rain. But for the first time this offense is making me want to leave early and do something fun. (I know I won't miss Wells giving Love a chance cuz he won't do that in a million years) I mean a REAL chance! Not one series in which Love looked good and did Nothing wrong but his first down pass was dropped after hitting the receiver in the hands.

Wells inability to decide to stop trotting out an INEFFECTIVE QB even after 3 straight 3 and outs, or pick 6's, or garbage time or whatever else is becoming the biggest reason I don't think Wells should continue as our coach.

For those that may not think Love is the answer. Go with DJ at least the dude has some competitive drive and heart. Or pull Colombi's redshirt, or let Hobbs run a wildcat or whatever. NOTHING can be worse than what we are seeing and we already know what we have in Myers!
Myers isn't the only problem, there are many others. But with regards to poor QB play, it has become blatantly obvious that our coaches aren't teaching the QB to go through a progression. We decide where the ball is going before the snap. Then when that receiver is covered, option B is called "PANIC!"

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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by oleblu111 » October 8th, 2017, 11:29 am

Yup, I guess Yost is a bust also.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by Intermeddler » October 8th, 2017, 11:36 am

Myers is awful. Truly bad. He is a good runner once he commits to running, but he isn't very good at picking his spots. Designed runs usually work but if he has to read someone to decide to run he isn't very good.

He is not accurate. His wind up is about the worst I have ever seen from a college QB with his experience. We have no deep threat at all in our offense because of his lack of arm strength.

And, he is a senior. The best thing for the program would be to turn things over to Love or Colombi. If Love is better Colombi can redshirt next year. If Colombi is better, he gets six games this year and three years as the starter.

I think some of the symptoms of "quitting" that we complain about are guys frustrated with Myers knowing that no matter how well they run their routes they won't get the ball, etc.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by NavyBlueAggie » October 8th, 2017, 11:36 am

To use the term we are so familiar with....... " Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result"



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by mcaggie1 » October 8th, 2017, 3:36 pm

NavyBlueAggie wrote:To use the term we are so familiar with....... " Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result"
Exactly. BTW, anyone remember Kirk Johnson? He threw it over everybody's head too. .... when he wasn't throwing the ball three feet in front of the receiver.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by aggies22 » October 8th, 2017, 5:23 pm

mcaggie1 wrote:
NavyBlueAggie wrote:To use the term we are so familiar with....... " Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result"
Exactly. BTW, anyone remember Kirk Johnson? He threw it over everybody's head too. .... when he wasn't throwing the ball three feet in front of the receiver.
Isn't Kirk Johnson who Matt Wells was benched for?



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by AggieSkiBum » October 8th, 2017, 5:48 pm

It doesn't matter at all how bad Myers plays, Wells will send him out anyway. Wells has made it pretty obvious that the only way he will play somebody else at QB is if there is no other alternative. We've got Myers until he graduates. Then, and only then, will Wells be forced to play somebody else. :rock:



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by 40Aggie » October 8th, 2017, 5:52 pm

aggies22 wrote:
mcaggie1 wrote:
NavyBlueAggie wrote:To use the term we are so familiar with....... " Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result"
Exactly. BTW, anyone remember Kirk Johnson? He threw it over everybody's head too. .... when he wasn't throwing the ball three feet in front of the receiver.
Isn't Kirk Johnson who Matt Wells was benched for?
Johnson was older than Wells. Wells was a redshirt frosh I believe in 1993. Johnson's last year was 1990 if memory serves, and he completed more passes to fans in rows 1-5 than to receivers.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by FloridaAggie13 » October 8th, 2017, 7:04 pm

aggies22 wrote:
mcaggie1 wrote:
NavyBlueAggie wrote:To use the term we are so familiar with....... " Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result"
Exactly. BTW, anyone remember Kirk Johnson? He threw it over everybody's head too. .... when he wasn't throwing the ball three feet in front of the receiver.
Isn't Kirk Johnson who Matt Wells was benched for?
Wells was benched for Aaaron Flowers in 1994; then Flowers was benched for Wells. And on and on until Weatherbie left for Navy. In 1995 John L. benched Wells for another guy from a military academy and then eventually Matt Sauk stepped in. I was long gone to Florida by then.

Kirk Johnson was the QB in 1989; in his defense, I don't think he was ever supposed to see the field but the starter, Kevin White who was pretty good, got lit up in the opener by Junior Seau/USC ending his career and giving us Kirk Johnson.

Man, I'm old.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by NVAggie » October 8th, 2017, 9:55 pm

Bravo on that memory. Seau was good at blowing people up. One of my favorites.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by Donman » October 8th, 2017, 10:27 pm

FloridaAggie13 wrote:
aggies22 wrote:
mcaggie1 wrote:
NavyBlueAggie wrote:To use the term we are so familiar with....... " Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result"
Exactly. BTW, anyone remember Kirk Johnson? He threw it over everybody's head too. .... when he wasn't throwing the ball three feet in front of the receiver.
Isn't Kirk Johnson who Matt Wells was benched for?
Wells was benched for Aaaron Flowers in 1994; then Flowers was benched for Wells. And on and on until Weatherbie left for Navy. In 1995 John L. benched Wells for another guy from a military academy and then eventually Matt Sauk stepped in. I was long gone to Florida by then.

Kirk Johnson was the QB in 1989; in his defense, I don't think he was ever supposed to see the field but the starter, Kevin White who was pretty good, got lit up in the opener by Junior Seau/USC ending his career and giving us Kirk Johnson.

Man, I'm old.
Johnson was replaced by Ron Lopez. Who wound up being pretty good

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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by mcaggie1 » October 8th, 2017, 10:54 pm

FloridaAggie13 wrote:
aggies22 wrote:
mcaggie1 wrote:
NavyBlueAggie wrote:To use the term we are so familiar with....... " Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result"
Exactly. BTW, anyone remember Kirk Johnson? He threw it over everybody's head too. .... when he wasn't throwing the ball three feet in front of the receiver.
Isn't Kirk Johnson who Matt Wells was benched for?
Wells was benched for Aaaron Flowers in 1994; then Flowers was benched for Wells. And on and on until Weatherbie left for Navy. In 1995 John L. benched Wells for another guy from a military academy and then eventually Matt Sauk stepped in. I was long gone to Florida by then.

Kirk Johnson was the QB in 1989; in his defense, I don't think he was ever supposed to see the field but the starter, Kevin White who was pretty good, got lit up in the opener by Junior Seau/USC ending his career and giving us Kirk Johnson.

Man, I'm old.
I'll trade you ages. Hint. I was 13 when Merlin Olsen graduated.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by Aglicious » October 8th, 2017, 11:15 pm

Listen, I will be the first to admit I am not a big Jordan Love fan based on his HS play (go back and check any thread that discusses him)... BUT I also can't deny that the difference between he and Myers in a game situation is as plain as night and day. The exact same play calls look completely different when Love runs them simply because of better timing and a quicker release. Those horrid WR screen passes to the sidelines that we all hate actually jump out of his hand and there is much more velocity and accuracy on every ball that he throws compared to Myers. I really think the WR's did a poor job of adjusting to balls thrown by Love because they genuinely look and feel different coming toward them.

Perhaps the biggest two differences though are 1) he actually has a sense of the pocket and how it works for the QB and 2) the ability to keep his eyes down field even under pressure. Love slid out of the pocket a couple of times, once taking off for a first down run and the other time to buy some extra time and continue to look for an open receiver which he did but the ball was dropped.

For those clamoring for Love to get more reps or more than ones series, the coaches have already come out and said that giving Love the first series of the 2nd qtr. is the plan and it doesn't matter what he does in those series, he doesn't earn more time or suddenly become the full-time starter as a result of it. This seems to me to be a colossal mistake because it is predetermining personnel decisions regardless of performance which doesn't foster a sense of competition. When there is no sense of competition within the team it carries over to when you are trying to compete against an opponent. Look at Stevens for example, we used to abuse that guy - he probably had nightmares of the Vigil brothers for weeks and CSU even questioned whether he was going to be the guy for them. They benched his (I can't express myself without swearing) and made him earn his way back as the starter and ever since he was made the starter again he has played like his job is on the line every time out there. Meanwhile, we get to watch Myers trot nonchalantly onto the field every offensive series, go three and out, and trot nonchalantly to the sidelines without a care or emotion in the world. His body language sucks for someone who should be a leader and yet the coaching staff has allowed this same behavior to go on for two years. Of course Wells body language matches that of Myers so I can see why there will never be a change.

To hear MW place the blame of the CSU loss on the OL and DL line play after the game makes me question even more what game he is watching. I have watched CSU run it down teams throat this season with Matthews and Dawkins and even when CSU made a point of trying to go to the run, I thought the DL played pretty well for the most part after the mid 2nd qtr., especially when you factor in that they are siting over there watching how inept our offense is and knowing they are not going to score any points for them. They kept coming out and getting stops and prevented more points from being put on the board. To me that shows growth and improvement from the Wiscy and WF games where they also lost their way and allowed the game to get out of hand.

No, this game was 150% on a single player and that was our QB. I'm all for team effort and winning and losing as a team but on offense you have to put up more than 7 points in trash time to win games and that all starts and ends with QB play. It is far past time to start planning for the future of this season and the seasons to come and that plan should not include #2 under center.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by Ahbye » October 9th, 2017, 5:41 am

I try to be pretty fair about what I write about players, and as such, I was all for Kent getting another start after the ISU game. I truly thought he was finally getting it. Only problem was that Kent also thought he was finally getting it and reverted back to his old self.

As someone with maybe a little more expertise than a 12 year old girl (but not much) due to having coached several college qb's at the high school level, I can tell you the exact difference between what Myers does wrong, and what Love did right. Love took his first passing snap, looked at his first read, nothing there. Immediately looked at his second, and fired it out right there into the receiver's hands...and then out again. Not Love's fault. On the first down drop, Love threw it before the receiver made his break...just like he was supposed to do. Problem is, the receivers are used to Kent. Kent NEVER throws his guys open. He NEVER has the ball there on time, which hurts us in at least two ways.

The system I played and coached under, we even went so far as to have to coach where hands should be through all phases of a route. Lots of guys drop their hands as they make their break, as if dropping your hands helps you slow down your feet or something. Problem with that is that when they come out of the break, their hands aren't up where the ball is supposed to be and they end up either having the ball bounce off of their pads, or worse, in the act of bringing their hands up reactively, they hit the ball up in the air for the defense. (Carson Terrell does this.) If you're wondering why both of Love's passes were dropped, there's your answer right there. The receivers are used to a different and improper timing and therefore don't have their hands up or their eyes around upon the delivery of a properly timed ball. That's the first way not throwing on time hurts us.

To better illustrate that point, the Stevens kid was throwing balls before his receivers broke all day long. There was one in the third quarter where his receiver ran a corner underneath a fly route on the outside. The ball was in the air long before the break and the receiver turned with his hands up, made the jumping catch where nobody else could get to it, and they had a big gain. There was only a millisecond of time between when the receiver got his head around and when the ball was there. The DB on that play was right with the receiver, which illustrates the fallacy that a qb can't make throws if his receivers can't get open or aren't open. It's both of their jobs to complete a pass. The receiver runs the right route and the qb throws on time. This is why you see plenty of slow wide receivers with mammoth catch totals. The kinder term they use for slow receivers is "possession receivers". In short, while a properly timed ball with a properly run route doesn't guarantee a completion, it does guarantee that the receiver will at least begin the first part of the catch by getting his hands on it. The DB may knock it out before the receiver can complete the catch, but the odds aren't great. The only reason you're going to your next read is if your receiver is re-routed by the DB (which negates the "properly run route" part of the equation) or if you're looking at what we call bracketed or helped coverage. In other words, there is a higher risk of interception because the defensive alignment is such that the defenders are shaded towards a particular receiver or zone. The second read on every properly designed play takes advantage of that imbalance by targeting the receiver who now has looser coverage. That's why a qb's reads are always linear or triangular in fashion and cover an orderly and localized part of the field before moving to the next. You're never looking at a receiver on one extreme side of the field and then clear over at another on the other side unless you've got a horrible play designer, and we don't have one of those, contrary to popular opinion. Timed throws after a proper read (of the defense, not the receiver) and good routes result in what CSU put out as a product on Saturday. When we speak of timing, it sounds like it's a pretty artsy life's work to be able to know when to throw a ball at a certain time to meet a certain target that's also moving, but it's really not. Routes have yardage lengths and qb drops have step lengths that are proven and coordinated to match up. In simple terms, any route under five yards gets a three step qb drop upon which the ball is thrown immediately. Anything 10-14 yards gets a five step with an immediate throw, anything longer gets a seven step (these are rare), with the exception of a fly route, which is dependent upon field position or strategy. (Back shoulder passes, etc.) Yes, we are at a disadvantage running out of the gun when it comes to timing, but there are ways to manage. Since we do a lot of play action, once that ball is pulled, that's about the time it takes for a three step drop. You pull and throw. With the longer routes, you make the throw a step before the receiver chops his feet down for the break. How do you know he's going to break? Because as qb, you dang well better know the distance and nature of the routes your receivers are running, along with any pre-snap adjustments made to routes due to coverage. These are all pre-planned adjustments, too. If for instance I'm supposed to run a 6 yard curl and the DB comes up into bump coverage, that pretty much takes that away. It's Football 101 automatic that I'm running a fade as an adjustment, if there are +2 safeties. If there are fewer safeties such as in a cover 1 or 0 I'm running a faded post. Those throws will have air under them and the qb can fade me deeper down field depending on where he needs me to be. He throws me open, out of coverage. (Posts are higher percentage throws because of the angles, so you always adjust to the higher percentage route.) There should never be "miscommunications" between qb and receiver. You either run the wrong route or he throws the wrong route. With time and reps, I believe these important concepts are what you get with Love.

OTOH, here's what you get with the style that Kent has settled into: Take the snap, go to your first read, wait for him to break. If on the break he's open because of amazing athleticism or trickery, you throw it. If not, improvise because you're behind the sack clock, tuck it and run or get sacked. (That's the second way not getting it out on time hurts, if it wasn't obvious.) If there were a betting line on what Kent does on every pass play, someone would be typing this as I dictated to them, while being salved and oiled by others (both myself and the dictatee) because I'd be that wealthy. Kent will ALWAYS, Always, always take a snap and improvise. He will always wait for a play to break down, not because he wants to, but because he's become conditioned to the results of not throwing on time to the proper read. If he doesn't get that first read in other words, the play is broken. Someone who has the time and access should find the statistical breakdowns of plays that succeed after a breakdown or upon improvisation. I'd put it at about 10%. The problem with even the successful miracles is that even if you complete that chest pass to Lajuan Hunt or Tarver off of the fumble (both happened against CSU), for one, the offense is in no position to block. Once the play is over, you get into what I would call "faces of death" mode. This is basically where everyone goes "phew, that was close", and their minds aren't on executing the next play. Those who are collecting the statistics should look to see how often a drive continues after the successful breakdown play. Oftentimes, the next play is a false start, turnover, or unsuccessful broken play. If you don't believe this is an issue, try and think of how you felt the last time after a near-miss while driving your car that would have been your fault. Even when nothing happens, you feel off for a period of time afterwards. It's why we fans can't settle in for long drives, because what we've come to expect from Kent is a seat-of-your-pants, only score on broken or amazing-feats-type offense. Teams like CSU and the Boise's of old score 90% of their points on routine plays that were just run correctly. Our offense is just the opposite with Kent at the helm. That's the end of my soliloquy.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by Machismo » October 9th, 2017, 6:01 am

Ahbye wrote:I try to be pretty fair about what I write about players, and as such, I was all for Kent getting another start after the ISU game. I truly thought he was finally getting it. Only problem was that Kent also thought he was finally getting it and reverted back to his old self.

As someone with maybe a little more expertise than a 12 year old girl (but not much) due to having coached several college qb's at the high school level, I can tell you the exact difference between what Myers does wrong, and what Love did right. Love took his first passing snap, looked at his first read, nothing there. Immediately looked at his second, and fired it out right there into the receiver's hands...and then out again. Not Love's fault. On the first down drop, Love threw it before the receiver made his break...just like he was supposed to do. Problem is, the receivers are used to Kent. Kent NEVER throws his guys open. He NEVER has the ball there on time, which hurts us in at least two ways.

The system I played and coached under, we even went so far as to have to coach where hands should be through all phases of a route. Lots of guys drop their hands as they make their break, as if dropping your hands helps you slow down your feet or something. Problem with that is that when they come out of the break, their hands aren't up where the ball is supposed to be and they end up either having the ball bounce off of their pads, or worse, in the act of bringing their hands up reactively, they hit the ball up in the air for the defense. (Carson Terrell does this.) If you're wondering why both of Love's passes were dropped, there's your answer right there. The receivers are used to a different and improper timing and therefore don't have their hands up or their eyes around upon the delivery of a properly timed ball. That's the first way not throwing on time hurts us.

To better illustrate that point, the Stevens kid was throwing balls before his receivers broke all day long. There was one in the third quarter where his receiver ran a corner underneath a fly route on the outside. The ball was in the air long before the break and the receiver turned with his hands up, made the jumping catch where nobody else could get to it, and they had a big gain. There was only a millisecond of time between when the receiver got his head around and when the ball was there. The DB on that play was right with the receiver, which illustrates the fallacy that a qb can't make throws if his receivers can't get open or aren't open. It's both of their jobs to complete a pass. The receiver runs the right route and the qb throws on time. This is why you see plenty of slow wide receivers with mammoth catch totals. The kinder term they use for slow receivers is "possession receivers". In short, while a properly timed ball with a properly run route doesn't guarantee a completion, it does guarantee that the receiver will at least begin the first part of the catch by getting his hands on it. The DB may knock it out before the receiver can complete the catch, but the odds aren't great. The only reason you're going to your next read is if your receiver is re-routed by the DB (which negates the "properly run route" part of the equation) or if you're looking at what we call bracketed or helped coverage. In other words, there is a higher risk of interception because the defensive alignment is such that the defenders are shaded towards a particular receiver or zone. The second read on every properly designed play takes advantage of that imbalance by targeting the receiver who now has looser coverage. That's why a qb's reads are always linear or triangular in fashion and cover an orderly and localized part of the field before moving to the next. You're never looking at a receiver on one extreme side of the field and then clear over at another on the other side unless you've got a horrible play designer, and we don't have one of those, contrary to popular opinion. Timed throws after a proper read (of the defense, not the receiver) and good routes result in what CSU put out as a product on Saturday. When we speak of timing, it sounds like it's a pretty artsy life's work to be able to know when to throw a ball at a certain time to meet a certain target that's also moving, but it's really not. Routes have yardage lengths and qb drops have step lengths that are proven and coordinated to match up. In simple terms, any route under five yards gets a three step qb drop upon which the ball is thrown immediately. Anything 10-14 yards gets a five step with an immediate throw, anything longer gets a seven step (these are rare), with the exception of a fly route, which is dependent upon field position or strategy. (Back shoulder passes, etc.) Yes, we are at a disadvantage running out of the gun when it comes to timing, but there are ways to manage. Since we do a lot of play action, once that ball is pulled, that's about the time it takes for a three step drop. You pull and throw. With the longer routes, you make the throw a step before the receiver chops his feet down for the break. How do you know he's going to break? Because as qb, you dang well better know the distance and nature of the routes your receivers are running, along with any pre-snap adjustments made to routes due to coverage. These are all pre-planned adjustments, too. If for instance I'm supposed to run a 6 yard curl and the DB comes up into bump coverage, that pretty much takes that away. It's Football 101 automatic that I'm running a fade as an adjustment, if there are +2 safeties. If there are fewer safeties such as in a cover 1 or 0 I'm running a faded post. Those throws will have air under them and the qb can fade me deeper down field depending on where he needs me to be. He throws me open, out of coverage. (Posts are higher percentage throws because of the angles, so you always adjust to the higher percentage route.) There should never be "miscommunications" between qb and receiver. You either run the wrong route or he throws the wrong route. With time and reps, I believe these important concepts are what you get with Love.

OTOH, here's what you get with the style that Kent has settled into: Take the snap, go to your first read, wait for him to break. If on the break he's open because of amazing athleticism or trickery, you throw it. If not, improvise because you're behind the sack clock, tuck it and run or get sacked. (That's the second way not getting it out on time hurts, if it wasn't obvious.) If there were a betting line on what Kent does on every pass play, someone would be typing this as I dictated to them, while being salved and oiled by others (both myself and the dictatee) because I'd be that wealthy. Kent will ALWAYS, Always, always take a snap and improvise. He will always wait for a play to break down, not because he wants to, but because he's become conditioned to the results of not throwing on time to the proper read. If he doesn't get that first read in other words, the play is broken. Someone who has the time and access should find the statistical breakdowns of plays that succeed after a breakdown or upon improvisation. I'd put it at about 10%. The problem with even the successful miracles is that even if you complete that chest pass to Lajuan Hunt or Tarver off of the fumble (both happened against CSU), for one, the offense is in no position to block. Once the play is over, you get into what I would call "faces of death" mode. This is basically where everyone goes "phew, that was close", and their minds aren't on executing the next play. Those who are collecting the statistics should look to see how often a drive continues after the successful breakdown play. Oftentimes, the next play is a false start, turnover, or unsuccessful broken play. If you don't believe this is an issue, try and think of how you felt the last time after a near-miss while driving your car that would have been your fault. Even when nothing happens, you feel off for a period of time afterwards. It's why we fans can't settle in for long drives, because what we've come to expect from Kent is a seat-of-your-pants, only score on broken or amazing-feats-type offense. Teams like CSU and the Boise's of old score 90% of their points on routine plays that were just run correctly. Our offense is just the opposite with Kent at the helm. That's the end of my soliloquy.
Very Interesting and informative post. So from you're description based on your experience and what you saw during the Game this Post is an Indictment of the Offensive Coaching Staff.
Sounds to me like these Kids are not being Coached correctly and it starts at the top.


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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by dyedblue » October 9th, 2017, 7:03 am

Great post Ahbye! This goes back to a post I had before the season started. It seems like our offense is built to dink and dunk our way down the field with bubble screens, short passes to the tight ends, and no run game. We are incapable of executing that style of play and have been for years. Once we get a holding call, illegal formation, ineligible downfield, false start, or a completed pass for -3 we are doomed. It makes no sense. We NEVER run a slant, a post, and rarely screen to the RB despite all out pressure from the ends.

On the other hand, a few things really stood out with CSU/Stevens. In the first quarter the killed us with designed plays in the flat. These weren't a mad scramble/fumble the ball to a RB and see what happens. They killed us with execution here.

The next play that stood out was a crossing pattern across the middle. Our DB was all over the slot receiver in perfect coverage and Stevens threw a bullet right into the receiver for about a 10 yard gain. Had we been out of position, or missed the tackle, it was going to be huge play. We never run this type of a play, nor could Myers sit in the pocket and for it to develop, let alone make that kind of throw.

The last one is all of the out patterns. It seemed many of these came from inside receivers and Stevens was just throwing to space between the receiver and sideline. There is literally nothing we could do to defend this because it was so well drawn up and executed.

We don't run these plays and even if we did all they would have to is cover Tarver because isn't going anywhere else. So frustrating. It is compounded by the fact I believe we have the talent to be good.

The other question I have is with the run game. WTH? That is all.


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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by Ahbye » October 9th, 2017, 8:08 am

Machismo wrote:
Ahbye wrote:I try to be pretty fair about what I write about players, and as such, I was all for Kent getting another start after the ISU game. I truly thought he was finally getting it. Only problem was that Kent also thought he was finally getting it and reverted back to his old self.

As someone with maybe a little more expertise than a 12 year old girl (but not much) due to having coached several college qb's at the high school level, I can tell you the exact difference between what Myers does wrong, and what Love did right. Love took his first passing snap, looked at his first read, nothing there. Immediately looked at his second, and fired it out right there into the receiver's hands...and then out again. Not Love's fault. On the first down drop, Love threw it before the receiver made his break...just like he was supposed to do. Problem is, the receivers are used to Kent. Kent NEVER throws his guys open. He NEVER has the ball there on time, which hurts us in at least two ways.

The system I played and coached under, we even went so far as to have to coach where hands should be through all phases of a route. Lots of guys drop their hands as they make their break, as if dropping your hands helps you slow down your feet or something. Problem with that is that when they come out of the break, their hands aren't up where the ball is supposed to be and they end up either having the ball bounce off of their pads, or worse, in the act of bringing their hands up reactively, they hit the ball up in the air for the defense. (Carson Terrell does this.) If you're wondering why both of Love's passes were dropped, there's your answer right there. The receivers are used to a different and improper timing and therefore don't have their hands up or their eyes around upon the delivery of a properly timed ball. That's the first way not throwing on time hurts us.

To better illustrate that point, the Stevens kid was throwing balls before his receivers broke all day long. There was one in the third quarter where his receiver ran a corner underneath a fly route on the outside. The ball was in the air long before the break and the receiver turned with his hands up, made the jumping catch where nobody else could get to it, and they had a big gain. There was only a millisecond of time between when the receiver got his head around and when the ball was there. The DB on that play was right with the receiver, which illustrates the fallacy that a qb can't make throws if his receivers can't get open or aren't open. It's both of their jobs to complete a pass. The receiver runs the right route and the qb throws on time. This is why you see plenty of slow wide receivers with mammoth catch totals. The kinder term they use for slow receivers is "possession receivers". In short, while a properly timed ball with a properly run route doesn't guarantee a completion, it does guarantee that the receiver will at least begin the first part of the catch by getting his hands on it. The DB may knock it out before the receiver can complete the catch, but the odds aren't great. The only reason you're going to your next read is if your receiver is re-routed by the DB (which negates the "properly run route" part of the equation) or if you're looking at what we call bracketed or helped coverage. In other words, there is a higher risk of interception because the defensive alignment is such that the defenders are shaded towards a particular receiver or zone. The second read on every properly designed play takes advantage of that imbalance by targeting the receiver who now has looser coverage. That's why a qb's reads are always linear or triangular in fashion and cover an orderly and localized part of the field before moving to the next. You're never looking at a receiver on one extreme side of the field and then clear over at another on the other side unless you've got a horrible play designer, and we don't have one of those, contrary to popular opinion. Timed throws after a proper read (of the defense, not the receiver) and good routes result in what CSU put out as a product on Saturday. When we speak of timing, it sounds like it's a pretty artsy life's work to be able to know when to throw a ball at a certain time to meet a certain target that's also moving, but it's really not. Routes have yardage lengths and qb drops have step lengths that are proven and coordinated to match up. In simple terms, any route under five yards gets a three step qb drop upon which the ball is thrown immediately. Anything 10-14 yards gets a five step with an immediate throw, anything longer gets a seven step (these are rare), with the exception of a fly route, which is dependent upon field position or strategy. (Back shoulder passes, etc.) Yes, we are at a disadvantage running out of the gun when it comes to timing, but there are ways to manage. Since we do a lot of play action, once that ball is pulled, that's about the time it takes for a three step drop. You pull and throw. With the longer routes, you make the throw a step before the receiver chops his feet down for the break. How do you know he's going to break? Because as qb, you dang well better know the distance and nature of the routes your receivers are running, along with any pre-snap adjustments made to routes due to coverage. These are all pre-planned adjustments, too. If for instance I'm supposed to run a 6 yard curl and the DB comes up into bump coverage, that pretty much takes that away. It's Football 101 automatic that I'm running a fade as an adjustment, if there are +2 safeties. If there are fewer safeties such as in a cover 1 or 0 I'm running a faded post. Those throws will have air under them and the qb can fade me deeper down field depending on where he needs me to be. He throws me open, out of coverage. (Posts are higher percentage throws because of the angles, so you always adjust to the higher percentage route.) There should never be "miscommunications" between qb and receiver. You either run the wrong route or he throws the wrong route. With time and reps, I believe these important concepts are what you get with Love.

OTOH, here's what you get with the style that Kent has settled into: Take the snap, go to your first read, wait for him to break. If on the break he's open because of amazing athleticism or trickery, you throw it. If not, improvise because you're behind the sack clock, tuck it and run or get sacked. (That's the second way not getting it out on time hurts, if it wasn't obvious.) If there were a betting line on what Kent does on every pass play, someone would be typing this as I dictated to them, while being salved and oiled by others (both myself and the dictatee) because I'd be that wealthy. Kent will ALWAYS, Always, always take a snap and improvise. He will always wait for a play to break down, not because he wants to, but because he's become conditioned to the results of not throwing on time to the proper read. If he doesn't get that first read in other words, the play is broken. Someone who has the time and access should find the statistical breakdowns of plays that succeed after a breakdown or upon improvisation. I'd put it at about 10%. The problem with even the successful miracles is that even if you complete that chest pass to Lajuan Hunt or Tarver off of the fumble (both happened against CSU), for one, the offense is in no position to block. Once the play is over, you get into what I would call "faces of death" mode. This is basically where everyone goes "phew, that was close", and their minds aren't on executing the next play. Those who are collecting the statistics should look to see how often a drive continues after the successful breakdown play. Oftentimes, the next play is a false start, turnover, or unsuccessful broken play. If you don't believe this is an issue, try and think of how you felt the last time after a near-miss while driving your car that would have been your fault. Even when nothing happens, you feel off for a period of time afterwards. It's why we fans can't settle in for long drives, because what we've come to expect from Kent is a seat-of-your-pants, only score on broken or amazing-feats-type offense. Teams like CSU and the Boise's of old score 90% of their points on routine plays that were just run correctly. Our offense is just the opposite with Kent at the helm. That's the end of my soliloquy.
Very Interesting and informative post. So from you're description based on your experience and what you saw during the Game this Post is an Indictment of the Offensive Coaching Staff.
Sounds to me like these Kids are not being Coached correctly and it starts at the top.
It's an indictment on Kent. Love came in and went through progressions and got the ball out. Kent gets taught that but doesn't put it into use. Where the coaches come in with fault is by not playing Love more.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by gomretat » October 9th, 2017, 8:18 am

We obviously don't have a QB who can throw downfield and that issue is made a lot worse by the fact that we still dont' have a quality running back. I may be alone on this but I don't think Wells is blind to his situation. He knows his job is on the line and he needs to win. If he thought changing QB's gave us a better chance to win I am sure he would do it. Every fan base clamors for the back ups when things aren't going well and they are sure the one who will save them is on the bench. Most of the time that turns out to be false. Love can clearly throw the ball downfield but what is it that makes Wells and Yost think he is not ready? And I do think Yost has a say in this.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by USU78 » October 9th, 2017, 8:26 am

Ahbye makes clear the answer to the question, "Why no two quarterbacks? Why no more snaps for Love?"

To put love in half the time would be to completely screw with the heads of the receivers. They would have to change their thinking, since they cannot presently cope with competence. They have learned to adjust to incompetence to the extent that competence baffles them. What an awful situation. I wonder how Jordan and the rest of the younger receivers will respond next year if suddenly there is nothing but competence?


You keep using that word. I do not think that word means what you think it means.

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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by Elkaggie » October 9th, 2017, 9:44 am

wams747 wrote:I am so done with Myers it is ridiculous! He is THE problem.

Offensive talent may not be fantastic but we know Tarver can be a weapon, Dax is the best tight end in the Mountain West (probably), the O-line has improved a lot over last year, Nathan has shown flashes, although far from great I think even Hunt and Allen could be VERY serviceable if we had any semblance of an offense that could consistently move the ball (the COMPLETE ineptitude of our passing game because of Myers is what makes us not have a running game).

I want to start chanting and its another Myers 3 and out. Every single Aggie I talk to is so done with him. The only thing he has been good at this year against half decent competition is taking a sack. For those that listened to Aggie call I whole heartedly agree with the hosts and believe that the majority of those sacks were not on the O-line or "coverage sacks." It is Myers complete lack of an ability to go through progressions, have a clock in his head, or even look like he has any clue out there. He can't make a decision so he just curls up in the fetal position to tack a sack.

Kent "Take a Sack" Myers, at least he is VERY stingy with the ball and doesn't turn it over.... oh wait he has a 1:1 TD to INT ratio.

Referring to the offense my wife said it is a long way to drive when it is not even fun to watch. (We live in the SL area).

I am a loyal and long-time Aggie and pretty close to never leave early. I drove to San Diego after the Boise win in 2015 and never even thought about leaving early with the butt whooping they put on us and I can say the same for the one they put on us last year in Logan in the rain. But for the first time this offense is making me want to leave early and do something fun. (I know I won't miss Wells giving Love a chance cuz he won't do that in a million years) I mean a REAL chance! Not one series in which Love looked good and did Nothing wrong but his first down pass was dropped after hitting the receiver in the hands.

Wells inability to decide to stop trotting out an INEFFECTIVE QB even after 3 straight 3 and outs, or pick 6's, or garbage time or whatever else is becoming the biggest reason I don't think Wells should continue as our coach.

For those that may not think Love is the answer. Go with DJ at least the dude has some competitive drive and heart. Or pull Colombi's redshirt, or let Hobbs run a wildcat or whatever. NOTHING can be worse than what we are seeing and we already know what we have in Myers!
Sorry you are wrong. That was another pathetic performance by the O line. They have not improved at all and this is the biggest problem with our Offense. Our offense as a whole is an absolute Dumpster fire. KM is part of it but he is not the only problem. The O line is absolutely horrible. Until this is fixed, which probably won't ever happen, we will struggle like we did on Saturday, end of story.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by NVAggie » October 9th, 2017, 10:22 am

Oh good, another season of varying opinions. It's Kent...no it's the O line...no it's the RBs,...no it's the WR. Maybe they all stink.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by Elkaggie » October 9th, 2017, 10:24 am

NVAggie wrote:Oh good, another season of varying opinions. It's Kent...no it's the O line...no it's the RBs,...no it's the WR. Maybe they all stink.
Bingo.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by oleblu111 » October 9th, 2017, 11:52 am

Ahbye wrote:I try to be pretty fair about what I write about players, and as such, I was all for Kent getting another start after the ISU game. I truly thought he was finally getting it. Only problem was that Kent also thought he was finally getting it and reverted back to his old self.

As someone with maybe a little more expertise than a 12 year old girl (but not much) due to having coached several college qb's at the high school level, I can tell you the exact difference between what Myers does wrong, and what Love did right. Love took his first passing snap, looked at his first read, nothing there. Immediately looked at his second, and fired it out right there into the receiver's hands...and then out again. Not Love's fault. On the first down drop, Love threw it before the receiver made his break...just like he was supposed to do. Problem is, the receivers are used to Kent. Kent NEVER throws his guys open. He NEVER has the ball there on time, which hurts us in at least two ways.

The system I played and coached under, we even went so far as to have to coach where hands should be through all phases of a route. Lots of guys drop their hands as they make their break, as if dropping your hands helps you slow down your feet or something. Problem with that is that when they come out of the break, their hands aren't up where the ball is supposed to be and they end up either having the ball bounce off of their pads, or worse, in the act of bringing their hands up reactively, they hit the ball up in the air for the defense. (Carson Terrell does this.) If you're wondering why both of Love's passes were dropped, there's your answer right there. The receivers are used to a different and improper timing and therefore don't have their hands up or their eyes around upon the delivery of a properly timed ball. That's the first way not throwing on time hurts us.

To better illustrate that point, the Stevens kid was throwing balls before his receivers broke all day long. There was one in the third quarter where his receiver ran a corner underneath a fly route on the outside. The ball was in the air long before the break and the receiver turned with his hands up, made the jumping catch where nobody else could get to it, and they had a big gain. There was only a millisecond of time between when the receiver got his head around and when the ball was there. The DB on that play was right with the receiver, which illustrates the fallacy that a qb can't make throws if his receivers can't get open or aren't open. It's both of their jobs to complete a pass. The receiver runs the right route and the qb throws on time. This is why you see plenty of slow wide receivers with mammoth catch totals. The kinder term they use for slow receivers is "possession receivers". In short, while a properly timed ball with a properly run route doesn't guarantee a completion, it does guarantee that the receiver will at least begin the first part of the catch by getting his hands on it. The DB may knock it out before the receiver can complete the catch, but the odds aren't great. The only reason you're going to your next read is if your receiver is re-routed by the DB (which negates the "properly run route" part of the equation) or if you're looking at what we call bracketed or helped coverage. In other words, there is a higher risk of interception because the defensive alignment is such that the defenders are shaded towards a particular receiver or zone. The second read on every properly designed play takes advantage of that imbalance by targeting the receiver who now has looser coverage. That's why a qb's reads are always linear or triangular in fashion and cover an orderly and localized part of the field before moving to the next. You're never looking at a receiver on one extreme side of the field and then clear over at another on the other side unless you've got a horrible play designer, and we don't have one of those, contrary to popular opinion. Timed throws after a proper read (of the defense, not the receiver) and good routes result in what CSU put out as a product on Saturday. When we speak of timing, it sounds like it's a pretty artsy life's work to be able to know when to throw a ball at a certain time to meet a certain target that's also moving, but it's really not. Routes have yardage lengths and qb drops have step lengths that are proven and coordinated to match up. In simple terms, any route under five yards gets a three step qb drop upon which the ball is thrown immediately. Anything 10-14 yards gets a five step with an immediate throw, anything longer gets a seven step (these are rare), with the exception of a fly route, which is dependent upon field position or strategy. (Back shoulder passes, etc.) Yes, we are at a disadvantage running out of the gun when it comes to timing, but there are ways to manage. Since we do a lot of play action, once that ball is pulled, that's about the time it takes for a three step drop. You pull and throw. With the longer routes, you make the throw a step before the receiver chops his feet down for the break. How do you know he's going to break? Because as qb, you dang well better know the distance and nature of the routes your receivers are running, along with any pre-snap adjustments made to routes due to coverage. These are all pre-planned adjustments, too. If for instance I'm supposed to run a 6 yard curl and the DB comes up into bump coverage, that pretty much takes that away. It's Football 101 automatic that I'm running a fade as an adjustment, if there are +2 safeties. If there are fewer safeties such as in a cover 1 or 0 I'm running a faded post. Those throws will have air under them and the qb can fade me deeper down field depending on where he needs me to be. He throws me open, out of coverage. (Posts are higher percentage throws because of the angles, so you always adjust to the higher percentage route.) There should never be "miscommunications" between qb and receiver. You either run the wrong route or he throws the wrong route. With time and reps, I believe these important concepts are what you get with Love.

OTOH, here's what you get with the style that Kent has settled into: Take the snap, go to your first read, wait for him to break. If on the break he's open because of amazing athleticism or trickery, you throw it. If not, improvise because you're behind the sack clock, tuck it and run or get sacked. (That's the second way not getting it out on time hurts, if it wasn't obvious.) If there were a betting line on what Kent does on every pass play, someone would be typing this as I dictated to them, while being salved and oiled by others (both myself and the dictatee) because I'd be that wealthy. Kent will ALWAYS, Always, always take a snap and improvise. He will always wait for a play to break down, not because he wants to, but because he's become conditioned to the results of not throwing on time to the proper read. If he doesn't get that first read in other words, the play is broken. Someone who has the time and access should find the statistical breakdowns of plays that succeed after a breakdown or upon improvisation. I'd put it at about 10%. The problem with even the successful miracles is that even if you complete that chest pass to Lajuan Hunt or Tarver off of the fumble (both happened against CSU), for one, the offense is in no position to block. Once the play is over, you get into what I would call "faces of death" mode. This is basically where everyone goes "phew, that was close", and their minds aren't on executing the next play. Those who are collecting the statistics should look to see how often a drive continues after the successful breakdown play. Oftentimes, the next play is a false start, turnover, or unsuccessful broken play. If you don't believe this is an issue, try and think of how you felt the last time after a near-miss while driving your car that would have been your fault. Even when nothing happens, you feel off for a period of time afterwards. It's why we fans can't settle in for long drives, because what we've come to expect from Kent is a seat-of-your-pants, only score on broken or amazing-feats-type offense. Teams like CSU and the Boise's of old score 90% of their points on routine plays that were just run correctly. Our offense is just the opposite with Kent at the helm. That's the end of my soliloquy.
That a informative post on the skill players on the team. My experience is as a lineman as a player and coach, so what I see is a massive lack of talent at Running back, and run blocking, pass blocking is not as bad as it seems because we hold the ball for a long time before the pass, however it needs major improvement. I saw very poor foot movement by several linemen on pass attempts, poor pad level on running play's. This line is new for several reasons mostly it is a group that could not make it at the school they were recruited to, and one wonders why you have 5 new starters this season.

If we had a running back that could break thru cloud cover, the O line would look better, if receivers would block on screen passes that would be nice.

When Wells said we got beat in the trenches he was as right as he could be, we got worked on both sides of the ball. I did enjoy the play when our D. Lineman twisted the ankle of the running back from CSU enough that he had to leave the game.

This team lacks toughness, and appears timid, that is not acceptable.

I think CSU wins the game regardless of who USU he plays at Q.B. because their talent level is much higher than our's. Of course it is the coach's job to have the talent to compete in conference play.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by aggies22 » October 9th, 2017, 4:59 pm

I remember having this same conversation near the end of Travis Cox senior year when fans were screaming for Leon Jackson. For the record I was one of them. I do think it is time to give Jordan his shot.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by 2004AG » October 9th, 2017, 6:55 pm

aggies22 wrote:I remember having this same conversation near the end of Travis Cox senior year when fans were screaming for Leon Jackson. For the record I was one of them. I do think it is time to give Jordan his shot.
Here’s the deal. We know what Myers is. We don’t know what Love is. Both might sucks but let’s at least try something new.


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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by AggieBlues » October 9th, 2017, 7:17 pm

Ahbye wrote:I try to be pretty fair about what I write about players, and as such, I was all for Kent getting another start after the ISU game. I truly thought he was finally getting it. Only problem was that Kent also thought he was finally getting it and reverted back to his old self. <snip...>
This, that and all of it a million times over. Thank you Ahbey for taking the time to write that megapost. It's well worth the read.

It was blatantly obvious that Nick Stevens knew how to throw to a route and Kent Myers doesn't. Kent only throws to the receiver traveling in one direction and wide open, and then overthrows him and/or out of bounds. God bless him, but he just doesn't have it.

I don't think I can spend the time/money/travel to another game where Kent is the QB. It makes me sick thinking of spending another 3 hours like we did on Saturday. I'm feeling Brent Guy levels of flashback trauma.

A new QB and a new coach could really maximize the talent we have. I really believe this. I'm sadly hoping we don't win enough games to keep Wells. And it really sucks to say that for the rest of the team that worked so hard this season.


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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by dyedblue » October 9th, 2017, 7:55 pm

Wells did say on 1280 this morning that the issue as line play on both sides and "QB" play. I was shocked. He also said had Love played better in his series he would have gotten another and that if he feels like he needs to he is not above switching quarterbacks. Very odd given that the offense under Meyers was inept and under Love we at least picked up a first down.


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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by NVAggie » October 9th, 2017, 10:29 pm

He’s going to have to prove up on that one. I’m not a believer. As for the line play, what is his plan?



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by TheConspirator » October 9th, 2017, 11:01 pm

dyedblue wrote:Wells did say on 1280 this morning that the issue as line play on both sides and "QB" play. I was shocked. He also said had Love played better in his series he would have gotten another and that if he feels like he needs to he is not above switching quarterbacks. Very odd given that the offense under Meyers was inept and under Love we at least picked up a first down.
Exactly. Love may not have played up to Wells' requirements to earn another series, but his one series was better than what Myers had done in his 3 series of work to that point. And if you take out the personal foul penalty, the Myers led offense amassed 8 total yards over his three series which is the same total as the Love led offense in one series.

Wells takes a similar approach to the running game. Refuses to adapt the style to more effectively use our personnel. Instead we do these slow, delayed zone read option handoffs where the QB is no longer reading the DE and the RB doesn't stand a chance. So we try a few of these "doomed from the start" runs and then he shrugs his shoulders and says "welp, the run ain't working". So the next logical step? Having Myers try and make throws he's incapable of making.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by hickaggie » October 9th, 2017, 11:15 pm

Elkaggie wrote:
wams747 wrote:I am so done with Myers it is ridiculous! He is THE problem.

Offensive talent may not be fantastic but we know Tarver can be a weapon, Dax is the best tight end in the Mountain West (probably), the O-line has improved a lot over last year, Nathan has shown flashes, although far from great I think even Hunt and Allen could be VERY serviceable if we had any semblance of an offense that could consistently move the ball (the COMPLETE ineptitude of our passing game because of Myers is what makes us not have a running game).

I want to start chanting and its another Myers 3 and out. Every single Aggie I talk to is so done with him. The only thing he has been good at this year against half decent competition is taking a sack. For those that listened to Aggie call I whole heartedly agree with the hosts and believe that the majority of those sacks were not on the O-line or "coverage sacks." It is Myers complete lack of an ability to go through progressions, have a clock in his head, or even look like he has any clue out there. He can't make a decision so he just curls up in the fetal position to tack a sack.

Kent "Take a Sack" Myers, at least he is VERY stingy with the ball and doesn't turn it over.... oh wait he has a 1:1 TD to INT ratio.

Referring to the offense my wife said it is a long way to drive when it is not even fun to watch. (We live in the SL area).

I am a loyal and long-time Aggie and pretty close to never leave early. I drove to San Diego after the Boise win in 2015 and never even thought about leaving early with the butt whooping they put on us and I can say the same for the one they put on us last year in Logan in the rain. But for the first time this offense is making me want to leave early and do something fun. (I know I won't miss Wells giving Love a chance cuz he won't do that in a million years) I mean a REAL chance! Not one series in which Love looked good and did Nothing wrong but his first down pass was dropped after hitting the receiver in the hands.

Wells inability to decide to stop trotting out an INEFFECTIVE QB even after 3 straight 3 and outs, or pick 6's, or garbage time or whatever else is becoming the biggest reason I don't think Wells should continue as our coach.

For those that may not think Love is the answer. Go with DJ at least the dude has some competitive drive and heart. Or pull Colombi's redshirt, or let Hobbs run a wildcat or whatever. NOTHING can be worse than what we are seeing and we already know what we have in Myers!
Sorry you are wrong. That was another pathetic performance by the O line. They have not improved at all and this is the biggest problem with our Offense. Our offense as a whole is an absolute Dumpster fire. KM is part of it but he is not the only problem. The O line is absolutely horrible. Until this is fixed, which probably won't ever happen, we will struggle like we did on Saturday, end of story.
You are right about the O-line. They have no agility and play with terrible technique. That doesn't mean Myers isn't a huge part of the problem too. O-lines get discouraged when they adjust to a pass rusher's move to give Myers a chance to step up and throw and he just stands there. When they are struggling and have a good play and give Kent 4+ seconds and he holds on to it before chucking it out of bounds or bouncing it in front of the receiver the O-line gets further down. They start to tune out their coaches and their own problems and blame the QB.

That is not an excuse for the O-line but its still an indictment of the quarterback. Two things can be true at the same time.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by LKGates » October 9th, 2017, 11:32 pm

mcaggie1 wrote: I'll trade you ages. Hint. I was 13 when Merlin Olsen graduated.
Got me beat. I was born the year Utah State Agricultural College became Utah State University of Agriculture and Applied Science. It was also the year Sputnik was launched, Atlas Shrugged was published, and Basil Hirschowitz invented the fiber optic gastroscope. In short, the year the modern age began.


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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by Ahbye » October 10th, 2017, 12:03 am

USU78 wrote:Ahbye makes clear the answer to the question, "Why no two quarterbacks? Why no more snaps for Love?"

To put love in half the time would be to completely screw with the heads of the receivers. They would have to change their thinking, since they cannot presently cope with competence. They have learned to adjust to incompetence to the extent that competence baffles them. What an awful situation. I wonder how Jordan and the rest of the younger receivers will respond next year if suddenly there is nothing but competence?
Thank you for having the knowledge to distill my novela into a succinct post that hits all the main ideas. You must have been raised by the Presbyterian minister on "A River Runs Through It". ("He taught nothing but reading and writing. And being a Scot...believed that the art of writing lay in thrift.")



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by Coloraggie » October 10th, 2017, 11:09 am

Ahbye wrote:
The system I played and coached under, we even went so far as to have to coach where hands should be through all phases of a route. Lots of guys drop their hands as they make their break, as if dropping your hands helps you slow down your feet or something. Problem with that is that when they come out of the break, their hands aren't up where the ball is supposed to be and they end up either having the ball bounce off of their pads, or worse, in the act of bringing their hands up reactively, they hit the ball up in the air for the defense. (Carson Terrell does this.) If you're wondering why both of Love's passes were dropped, there's your answer right there. The receivers are used to a different and improper timing and therefore don't have their hands up or their eyes around upon the delivery of a properly timed ball. That's the first way not throwing on time hurts us.
I had a similar thought about the wide receivers not being able to catch the ball because it actually hits them in the numbers and they don't have to stretch or be led helpless into the defender.



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Re: Jor-dan, Jor-dan, JOR-DAN

Post by ChicAggie » October 10th, 2017, 11:41 am

Good stuff, Ahbye. My take is that we should terminate Wells immediately and give Ahbye a shot. :)


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