Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by CastIronAggie » December 17th, 2020, 8:17 am

Imakeitrain wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 11:59 pm
NibleyAg wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 10:37 pm
Imakeitrain wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 8:18 pm
Empire of Dirt wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 6:54 pm
It's hard for me to imagine the level of persecution complex you'd have to have in order to think that as a Utah Mormon you were being discriminated against.

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There are certainly individual professors who discriminate against people of the predominant religion. Students have a right to learn in an environment that isn’t hostile. It’s also fairly strong in non teaching staff.

Utah may very well be predominantly lds- but higher education is still heavily not- to put it nicely.

Although USU is less discriminatory than most, it’s still prone to biases that exist in higher education.
I don't recall once during my college days at USU of having professors discuss religion with the class. I find it odd that some teachers would dig into a students religous preference in order to discriminate against them. If that is the case then they should not be professors.
I don’t think you need to be discussing religion specifically to discriminate. Nor do I think discussion is discrimination. There are appropriate places to discuss religion on campus. Dr. Kleiner’s philosophy class is probably one the better known places. Although he disagrees with the predominant religion he isn’t hostile and it’s in the context of getting students to think.

I’m talking about harassment and actual hostility which I saw mostly in CHaSS. I didn’t see it so much in other departments.

It’s certainly not all- or even most- but there are some very bigoted professors out there
I'm not going to lie. He was my least favorite professor in 4 years in Logan. Not because of the Mormon stuff, but because he made us buy a 200 dollar textbook that he was a coauthor of. It was loose-leaf so the bookstore wouldn't buy it back and then he switched to a new edition the next semester so I couldn't pass it on to another student. Not to mention how much I disliked the teaching method.
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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by Aggie formerly in Hawaii » December 17th, 2020, 8:59 am

Textbooks are another racket. I had a few professors do the same thing where they basically created a textbook in loos-leaf. You couldn't buy it back and it was just strung together so it was really of no value to keep.

Even worse were the professors who had you buy a textbook they rarely or never used.
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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by AGNUMPI » December 17th, 2020, 9:31 am

Aglicious wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 3:53 pm
ViAggie wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 2:59 pm
splintorb wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 2:58 pm
Sl7vk wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 2:57 pm
splintorb wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 2:56 pm
Sl7vk wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 2:40 pm
Henninger not coming out smelling like roses on all of this.....
What you hearing about him?
He's the one that put together the survey... survey was worded in a way that pushed the players answers in the direction he wanted. Looking more and more like the ring leader... or one of them.....
Verrrry interesting...
Verrrrry bad looking
Also makes a lot of sense. Remember he was one of the players featured in the last post game media session and was interviewed directly after coach Maile was done. He was asked about the 2020 frozen eligibility and the opportunity to return next year. He replied that his decision was "to be determined" as he looked at coach and then mumbled something about it being dependent on what is decided with the coaching staff. Sounded and looked like he was a big Maile fan and that was sort of his threat towards those in charge to give the job to Frank.
I'm starting to think that GA2.0 was a UofU prank on us. Blow up the football program from the inside.


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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by NVAggie » December 17th, 2020, 9:40 am

I am shocked that Gary 2.0 did nothing that made him successful during his Gary 1.0 stint. Strength and conditioning was a big deal the first go around, yet we looked completely outmanned. Reports around these parts are saying we didn't even work hard in the weight room. Gary 1.0 preached speed, yet the second stint was the slowest I have seen in a long time. Many of you were right. Gary 1.0 died the second he took the Wisconsin job.
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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by MWCFAN12 » December 17th, 2020, 10:11 am

CaptainChaos wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 3:42 pm
ViAggie wrote:
splintorb wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 2:58 pm
Sl7vk wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 2:57 pm
splintorb wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 2:56 pm
Sl7vk wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 2:40 pm
Henninger not coming out smelling like roses on all of this.....
What you hearing about him?
He's the one that put together the survey... survey was worded in a way that pushed the players answers in the direction he wanted. Looking more and more like the ring leader... or one of them.....
Verrrry interesting...
Verrrrry bad looking
Wow... I can’t believe how pathetic it is these chicken (I can't express myself without swearing) “leaders” wanted so badly not to play the last game of the year.


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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by JSHarvey » December 17th, 2020, 11:17 am

From the article: "The two, whose identities have not been made public, agreed this was the tenor of her statement: "

It is *not even alleged* to be a quote. There is no context. Pure hearsay combined with "push polling". I can't believe the players (and Frank) essentially went nuclear and blew the program apart over this non-issue.

I'm really hoping that Anderson can work a miracle.

JMO.
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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by AndroidAggie » December 17th, 2020, 11:25 am

i wouldn't say i was discriminated against, but i certainly felt hostility or antipathy about Mormons from my anthropology and history of Christianity professors. nothing earth shattering, so i mostly just assumed they had the moral fiber to treat me, and other mormons, fairly notwithstanding their personal opinions of our personal opinions.
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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by Imakeitrain » December 17th, 2020, 5:00 pm

The story continues to change. First we heard it was the team leadership council- now there were coaches, and other professors on the call. Also a tennis coach is a source. In fact Robinson only really uses one player as the source.

I would like to know how slight these “remembrances” it seems to me if something were SO OFFENSIVE the wording would be closer to exact as opposed to a general tenor.

https://www.deseret.com/sports/2020/12/ ... estigation


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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by AgMan21 » December 17th, 2020, 5:09 pm

Imakeitrain wrote:
December 17th, 2020, 5:00 pm
The story continues to change. First we heard it was the team leadership council- now there were coaches, and other professors on the call. Also a tennis coach is a source. In fact Robinson only really uses one player as the source.

I would like to know how slight these “remembrances” it seems to me if something were SO OFFENSIVE the wording would be closer to exact as opposed to a general tenor.

https://www.deseret.com/sports/2020/12/ ... estigation
Doug Robinson is a tool.
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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by Blue Sage » December 17th, 2020, 10:54 pm

AgMan21 wrote:
December 17th, 2020, 5:09 pm
Imakeitrain wrote:
December 17th, 2020, 5:00 pm
The story continues to change. First we heard it was the team leadership council- now there were coaches, and other professors on the call. Also a tennis coach is a source. In fact Robinson only really uses one player as the source.

I would like to know how slight these “remembrances” it seems to me if something were SO OFFENSIVE the wording would be closer to exact as opposed to a general tenor.

https://www.deseret.com/sports/2020/12/ ... estigation
Doug Robinson is a tool.
Never heard of Doug but the more I learn about the situation the more concerned I am about Cockett. I really feel if she would come out and disavow bigotry and racism it would go a long way. If she refuses to do so she should step down. Let’s see what metal ske is made of.



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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by bluegrouse » December 18th, 2020, 1:59 am

Sounds like McCarthyism at its finest. Vague, hearsay accusations and then a demand to publicly condemn communism and if you don’t, you’re obviously a communist. Her whole career is a disavowal of bigotry and racism. Why don’t we start there instead of one or two sentences in a meeting she attended by request that nobody even seems capable of quoting. How about we demand that they tell us what she said first? How about that?
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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by Blue Sage » December 19th, 2020, 5:11 pm

bluegrouse wrote:
December 18th, 2020, 1:59 am
Sounds like McCarthyism at its finest. Vague, hearsay accusations and then a demand to publicly condemn communism and if you don’t, you’re obviously a communist. Her whole career is a disavowal of bigotry and racism. Why don’t we start there instead of one or two sentences in a meeting she attended by request that nobody even seems capable of quoting. How about we demand that they tell us what she said first? How about that?
Yup, McCarthyism on steroids is the reality we live in. :anonymous: I doubt you will get your demand. The reality we live in these days is far more about perception than anything. We live in a post truth, cancel culture society. If Utah State doesn't recognize the position they are in and act fast it could do real long lasting damage deserved or not. Therefore considering the world we live in, it is best for Cocket to quickly speak against bigotry and racism. If she isn't willing to do this, USU risks the wound metastasizing and becoming even worse. This is a lot bigger than Cocket so I'd prefer that she step down if she isn't willing to either submit to your demand or make a statement before Utah State gets cancelled. :bananafire: :bananafire: :bananafire:
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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by jpswensen » December 19th, 2020, 11:28 pm

AggieHead wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 4:29 pm
IF USU has a competent HR department, and IF the AD and president followed proper hiring protocols, ie screening criteria, hiring rubrics, and documentation of how BA meets the hiring criteria, then they are going to be fine. There is a reason that proper hiring procedure is a pain in the (I can't express myself without swearing), those protocols are so that if someone claims discrimination, you have evidence to defend the decision. If hiring a football coach is a fly by the seat of your pants, informal process based on a "gut feeling" then there will be trouble. I can't imagine hiring the highest paid (or among the highest paid) and highest profile position at USU doesn't come with all of the proper hiring procedure, forms, and criteria that is required to hire a secretary.

Also, the quotes literally make no sense without context. Also, according to the graph of possible responses, there must have been like 20 options to choose from. There are some very tiny slices to that pie.
I think most universities follow processes and procedures to the T. I have been on our department's faculty search committees for the last three years, and we can't even start looking at candidate materials until we have (1) taken/re-taken the entire hiring training module, (2) taken/re-taken the implicit bias training, (3) defined a rating/scoring rubric and get sign-off from both the department chair and the dean. Then there are even more checks along the way as we whittle down from hundreds of candidates to the 10-20 for phone interview and then more checks along the way as we whittle down to 2-5 for on site interviews.

I suspect that coaching searches that involves money commitments on the order of millions of dollars (instead of engineering faculty where the initial investment is more along the lines of hundreds of thousands), have even more scrutiny in terms of dotting i's and crossing t's.
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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by GUS » December 20th, 2020, 8:46 am

Blue Sage wrote:
December 19th, 2020, 5:11 pm
bluegrouse wrote:
December 18th, 2020, 1:59 am
Sounds like McCarthyism at its finest. Vague, hearsay accusations and then a demand to publicly condemn communism and if you don’t, you’re obviously a communist. Her whole career is a disavowal of bigotry and racism. Why don’t we start there instead of one or two sentences in a meeting she attended by request that nobody even seems capable of quoting. How about we demand that they tell us what she said first? How about that?
Yup, McCarthyism on steroids is the reality we live in. :anonymous: I doubt you will get your demand. The reality we live in these days is far more about perception than anything. We live in a post truth, cancel culture society. If Utah State doesn't recognize the position they are in and act fast it could do real long lasting damage deserved or not. Therefore considering the world we live in, it is best for Cocket to quickly speak against bigotry and racism. If she isn't willing to do this, USU risks the wound metastasizing and becoming even worse. This is a lot bigger than Cocket so I'd prefer that she step down if she isn't willing to either submit to your demand or make a statement before Utah State gets cancelled. :bananafire: :bananafire: :bananafire:
I have zero concern of USU getting canceled. The wokeness of today won't last. It will eventually eat itself up because there's no reality in it.
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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by NavyBlueAggie » December 20th, 2020, 12:36 pm

So the team prepares all week following the meeting with NOELLE COCKETT with regular team meetings, standard coaching preparation and live practices, to then decide on Friday, the day before the game, to boycott the event? Lots of moving parts here, and in a food fight like this everyone gets hit. The last minute travel cancellation fees must have been enormous and I suspect they are yet being calculated.

The actual quote attributed to a socially seasoned school president like NOELLE COCKETT seems more like a direct response to a player.
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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by Stewie Griffin » December 21st, 2020, 8:17 am

AggieUprising50 wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 11:54 am
"What do we say to outside people who ask us about hiring an LDS person from Utah? We tried that, and it didn’t work."

You say you think he’s the best person for the job. Who cares what outside people say or think?! And who cares if Other LDS candidates from Utah didn’t work? Although I don’t think she meant to discriminate or say anything offensive, her points are irrelevant and stupid. All she needed to say was that they felt they needed a head coach with more experience and a history of winning consistently.

Do I think she should be fired or sued? No. Do I think she said something really stupid? Absolutely.
I'm reading this as a question:
"What do we say to outside people who ask us about hiring an LDS person from Utah?
We tried that and it didn't work???"
It's a question not a comment.
In other words, is this what we should say?



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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by Stewie Griffin » December 21st, 2020, 8:22 am

ViAggie wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 2:32 pm
TrueAG wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 2:24 pm
bpd wrote:
December 16th, 2020, 2:08 pm
rAggies is posting some interesting info on his twitter from the survery.
What his twitter
I post only because we all know who rAggie is - and yes, if this is true, he's 100% correct (and I predicted correctly, there's something else going on here):

Why is it only Channel 2 that is keeping this crap moving? No other channels are interested. Can you say "witch hunt"?



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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by USU78 » December 21st, 2020, 8:37 am

Push Poll.


You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by AggiesForever » December 22nd, 2020, 8:44 am

Chris Pella is who I think they are referring to-- the local guy, member of the church, etc, that everybody clammored for back in the day. Nearly took down the whole ship.



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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by 3rdGenAggie » December 22nd, 2020, 9:18 am

Somebody needs to ask the 1280 guys and the local media if Frank would be considered at BYU or Utah if Sitake or Whitt left.

If not, why should he have gotten the USU job? Frank's religion had nothing to do with him not being hired (especially considering that the guy they hired is much more public about his christian religion than Frank is).
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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by AngusAg » December 22nd, 2020, 10:25 am

AggiesForever wrote:
December 22nd, 2020, 8:44 am
Chris Pella is who I think they are referring to-- the local guy, member of the church, etc, that everybody clammored for back in the day. Nearly took down the whole ship.
This was my thought as well. If this comes down to an ignored or implied " just" I'm gonna be pissed.
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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by El Sapo » December 22nd, 2020, 10:29 am

AngusAg wrote:
December 22nd, 2020, 10:25 am
AggiesForever wrote:
December 22nd, 2020, 8:44 am
Chris Pella is who I think they are referring to-- the local guy, member of the church, etc, that everybody clammored for back in the day. Nearly took down the whole ship.
This was my thought as well. If this comes down to an ignored or implied " just" I'm gonna be pissed.
She was talking about Frank. No way she knows who Chris Pella is. I doubt Hartwell knows who he is.
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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by AngusAg » December 22nd, 2020, 10:36 am

El Sapo wrote:
December 22nd, 2020, 10:29 am
AngusAg wrote:
December 22nd, 2020, 10:25 am
AggiesForever wrote:
December 22nd, 2020, 8:44 am
Chris Pella is who I think they are referring to-- the local guy, member of the church, etc, that everybody clammored for back in the day. Nearly took down the whole ship.
This was my thought as well. If this comes down to an ignored or implied " just" I'm gonna be pissed.
She was talking about Frank. No way she knows who Chris Pella is. I doubt Hartwell knows who he is.
You may be right, but I guarantee there were some involved in the process that clearly remember the Pella debacle.



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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by cval » December 22nd, 2020, 11:40 am

I have actually been thinking all along that this was all about an "ignored or implied " just"."

That is really the only thing that makes sense given what we do know about what was said....



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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by El Sapo » December 22nd, 2020, 3:57 pm

cval wrote:
December 22nd, 2020, 11:40 am
I have actually been thinking all along that this was all about an "ignored or implied " just"."

That is really the only thing that makes sense given what we do know about what was said....
:cheers: We "just" tried it (Frank) and it didn't work.


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Re: Cockett comments from sources to channel 2.

Post by Donman » December 22nd, 2020, 4:06 pm

El Sapo wrote:
December 22nd, 2020, 3:57 pm
cval wrote:
December 22nd, 2020, 11:40 am
I have actually been thinking all along that this was all about an "ignored or implied " just"."

That is really the only thing that makes sense given what we do know about what was said....
:cheers: We "just" tried it (Frank) and it didn't work.
I would love to know what question was asked.



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