Baseball substance checks are getting ridiculous

Imakeitrain · Post by **Imakeitrain** » June 23rd, 2021, 6:49 am

They checked Scherzer 3 times and then rubbed their hands through his hair. I'm just wondering at what point the umpires had the thought of "Yeah, I should probably rub my hands through his hair, that seems like a good idea"

sam tingey · Post by **sam tingey** » June 23rd, 2021, 8:24 pm

How about the Angels vs the Giants. First game in history where the NL team used the DH and the AL team did not since they had Ohtani pitching. what a weird circumstance. Also the Giants won so there's that. Sorry, not sorry ProvoAggie

sam tingey · Post by **sam tingey** » June 23rd, 2021, 10:18 pm

It looks like manfred isn't fazed by the idiocy of the checks. He really wants to get more offense into the game I guess. Pitchers just shouldn't cheat, but that is pretty idealistic of me. TV shouldn't broadcast the checks. I like Scherzer's suggestion of doing the checks in the clubhouse and not on the field by the umps. It really is a bad look when you just always assume the pitcher is cheating and make them go through a search on the field out in public (especially three times).

OKAggie · Post by **OKAggie** » June 24th, 2021, 10:16 am

Orioles have a new reliever who throws mostly knuckleballs. They checked him every inning last night, even though his desired spin rate is about 1 rpm. Functional equivalent of the TSA patdown of the 87-year old granny on a walker.

Floppy Hat · Post by **Floppy Hat** » June 24th, 2021, 11:09 am

Major League Baseball and Manfred continue to make these idiotic decisions that make the game look ridiculous. The answer to this issue is building a better baseball that strikes a balance between being slick and grippy. The baseball used in the Japanese league has much more grip than the American version. Instead MLB insists on using a decades old covering that they then rub in mud from south Jersey.

They could have done a much better job of addressing this issue instead of the absurdity that has rolled out over the last few days.

Yossarian · Post by **Yossarian** » June 24th, 2021, 11:09 am

OKAggie wrote: ↑
June 24th, 2021, 10:16 am
Orioles have a new reliever who throws mostly knuckleballs. They checked him every inning last night, even though his desired spin rate is about 1 rpm. Functional equivalent of the TSA patdown of the 87-year old granny on a walker.

To add to the ridiculousness of this:

I watched that Orioles game last night (the self-flagellation of a lifelong Orioles fan - don't ask). The knuckleballer in question was a 33 year-old rookie pitching in his first MLB game. HIs knuckleball wasn't moving in a typical knuckleball fashion ("dancing" or "wobbling") and essentially was just a 79 mph pitch that didn't fool anybody. He pitched 3 innings and gave up 8 hits, 4 walks, 7 runs, 3 homeruns - but he did strike a guy out.

The protocol they had was to check a pitcher when he entered the game and if he pitched more than a few innings, they would check him again. Then they checked the pitcher as he left the field. From what I have seen, they stop a pitcher as he's leaving the field near the dugout. They look at his glove, hat, and arms. The "best" formula for getting better grip on the ball is a mixture of sunscreen and rosin placed on the forearm.

For those interested, this is a good video of how sticky grip and spin rate have changed pitching in recent years:

Pitching contracts in recent years have largely been more lucrative for those that can spin it better. Even free-agent contracts have been given out to those pitchers with the best "formulas" for grip or the promise a team could make for improving a free agents grip and effectiveness if he signs with them.

Trevor Bauer is the main focus of the video, but it is universal.

One unintended consequence of getting rid of the sticky grip is hit batsmen and star players being injured. The pitchers have complained in recent years of the balls being "dusty" and "slick". Taking away the sticky substances that allow them to grip the balls better may lead to less control. It isn't fun for a batter not being able to trust that a pitcher 60 feet 6 inches away from him throwing a rock at 98 mph doesn't have a good grip on the ball and doesn't really know where it's going.

I had read one article that they may be experimenting in a minor league or winter league with moving the pitcher's mound back 12 inches to level the playing field a little more. Too many pitchers throwing in the high 90s with too much spin/movement on their fastballs is leading to too many strikeouts and nobody wants to watch a game where the only thing you see are walks, strikeouts and homeruns. That isn't exciting.

Sorry for the rant.

Imakeitrain · Post by **Imakeitrain** » June 25th, 2021, 9:17 am

Yossarian wrote: ↑
June 24th, 2021, 11:09 am

OKAggie wrote: ↑
June 24th, 2021, 10:16 am
Orioles have a new reliever who throws mostly knuckleballs. They checked him every inning last night, even though his desired spin rate is about 1 rpm. Functional equivalent of the TSA patdown of the 87-year old granny on a walker.
To add to the ridiculousness of this:

I watched that Orioles game last night (the self-flagellation of a lifelong Orioles fan - don't ask). The knuckleballer in question was a 33 year-old rookie pitching in his first MLB game. HIs knuckleball wasn't moving in a typical knuckleball fashion ("dancing" or "wobbling") and essentially was just a 79 mph pitch that didn't fool anybody. He pitched 3 innings and gave up 8 hits, 4 walks, 7 runs, 3 homeruns - but he did strike a guy out.

The protocol they had was to check a pitcher when he entered the game and if he pitched more than a few innings, they would check him again. Then they checked the pitcher as he left the field. From what I have seen, they stop a pitcher as he's leaving the field near the dugout. They look at his glove, hat, and arms. The "best" formula for getting better grip on the ball is a mixture of sunscreen and rosin placed on the forearm.

For those interested, this is a good video of how sticky grip and spin rate have changed pitching in recent years:

Pitching contracts in recent years have largely been more lucrative for those that can spin it better. Even free-agent contracts have been given out to those pitchers with the best "formulas" for grip or the promise a team could make for improving a free agents grip and effectiveness if he signs with them.

Trevor Bauer is the main focus of the video, but it is universal.

One unintended consequence of getting rid of the sticky grip is hit batsmen and star players being injured. The pitchers have complained in recent years of the balls being "dusty" and "slick". Taking away the sticky substances that allow them to grip the balls better may lead to less control. It isn't fun for a batter not being able to trust that a pitcher 60 feet 6 inches away from him throwing a rock at 98 mph doesn't have a good grip on the ball and doesn't really know where it's going.

I had read one article that they may be experimenting in a minor league or winter league with moving the pitcher's mound back 12 inches to level the playing field a little more. Too many pitchers throwing in the high 90s with too much spin/movement on their fastballs is leading to too many strikeouts and nobody wants to watch a game where the only thing you see are walks, strikeouts and homeruns. That isn't exciting.

Sorry for the rant.

It’s not just the sunscreen.... it’s sweat too.. and pitchers were prior to Covid given rosin (I’m not sure if they switched back to sharing one rosin bag).

You can be suspended with barely any due process simply for using the rosin bag you’re given and sweating.
Trevor Bauer can do a trick where he can have a ball stick upside down on his hand with just sweat and rosin.

They’re harshly penalizing with high scrutiny a vague rule on the basis of an umpires subjective view.

Yossarian · Post by **Yossarian** » June 25th, 2021, 9:55 am

Imakeitrain wrote: ↑
June 25th, 2021, 9:17 am

Yossarian wrote: ↑
June 24th, 2021, 11:09 am

OKAggie wrote: ↑
June 24th, 2021, 10:16 am
Orioles have a new reliever who throws mostly knuckleballs. They checked him every inning last night, even though his desired spin rate is about 1 rpm. Functional equivalent of the TSA patdown of the 87-year old granny on a walker.
To add to the ridiculousness of this:

I watched that Orioles game last night (the self-flagellation of a lifelong Orioles fan - don't ask). The knuckleballer in question was a 33 year-old rookie pitching in his first MLB game. HIs knuckleball wasn't moving in a typical knuckleball fashion ("dancing" or "wobbling") and essentially was just a 79 mph pitch that didn't fool anybody. He pitched 3 innings and gave up 8 hits, 4 walks, 7 runs, 3 homeruns - but he did strike a guy out.

The protocol they had was to check a pitcher when he entered the game and if he pitched more than a few innings, they would check him again. Then they checked the pitcher as he left the field. From what I have seen, they stop a pitcher as he's leaving the field near the dugout. They look at his glove, hat, and arms. The "best" formula for getting better grip on the ball is a mixture of sunscreen and rosin placed on the forearm.

For those interested, this is a good video of how sticky grip and spin rate have changed pitching in recent years:

Pitching contracts in recent years have largely been more lucrative for those that can spin it better. Even free-agent contracts have been given out to those pitchers with the best "formulas" for grip or the promise a team could make for improving a free agents grip and effectiveness if he signs with them.

Trevor Bauer is the main focus of the video, but it is universal.

One unintended consequence of getting rid of the sticky grip is hit batsmen and star players being injured. The pitchers have complained in recent years of the balls being "dusty" and "slick". Taking away the sticky substances that allow them to grip the balls better may lead to less control. It isn't fun for a batter not being able to trust that a pitcher 60 feet 6 inches away from him throwing a rock at 98 mph doesn't have a good grip on the ball and doesn't really know where it's going.

I had read one article that they may be experimenting in a minor league or winter league with moving the pitcher's mound back 12 inches to level the playing field a little more. Too many pitchers throwing in the high 90s with too much spin/movement on their fastballs is leading to too many strikeouts and nobody wants to watch a game where the only thing you see are walks, strikeouts and homeruns. That isn't exciting.

Sorry for the rant.
It’s not just the sunscreen.... it’s sweat too.. and pitchers were prior to Covid given rosin (I’m not sure if they switched back to sharing one rosin bag).

You can be suspended with barely any due process simply for using the rosin bag you’re given and sweating.
Trevor Bauer can do a trick where he can have a ball stick upside down on his hand with just sweat and rosin.

They’re harshly penalizing with high scrutiny a vague rule on the basis of an umpires subjective view.

Yeah - the league has got to find a baseball or something to rub on the baseballs that make them less slick. The pitchers have been using the rosin bags on their arms for decades as a way to keep the sweat from running off their arms and onto their hands. They have to do something - Atlanta in July/August can get pretty humid.

Bank Shot · Post by **Bank Shot** » June 25th, 2021, 1:30 pm

IMO too much of the blame for decline in averages is being put on the pitchers. Everyone is in love with launch angle and swinging for the fences. I'm in the camp that baseball could liven up the game a lot by banning the shift or having infielders have one foot on the dirt, or both. With those changes maybe the game could revert back to it being important to put the ball in play instead of in the bleachers.

Upcoming Events

Event Results