Final approvals for Vet School

NowhereLandAggie · Post by **NowhereLandAggie** » July 22nd, 2022, 10:14 am

40 students from Utah will be admitted each year. Livestock are the largest Ag industry in Utah, and this is projected to help ease the shortage.

It really will open USU up to new research and grants as well. Noelle Cockett already has stated they will collaborate with the U of U med school on many different projects.

https://www.usu.edu/today/story/usu-col ... t-selected

Yossarian · Post by **Yossarian** » July 22nd, 2022, 10:25 am

Great news for the school and the state. A much needed niche filled.

USU78 · Post by **USU78** » July 22nd, 2022, 10:33 am

Hallelujah!

Dental school next?

BigBlueDart · Post by **BigBlueDart** » July 22nd, 2022, 11:54 am

Why don't Engineering Schools produce the same level of prestige for a University as Medical/Law/Veterinary?

dirtnsnow · Post by **dirtnsnow** » July 22nd, 2022, 12:20 pm

BigBlueDart wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 11:54 am
Why don't Engineering Schools produce the same level of prestige for a University as Medical/Law/Veterinary?

MIT would like a word.

BigBlueDart · Post by **BigBlueDart** » July 22nd, 2022, 12:41 pm

dirtnsnow wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 12:20 pm

BigBlueDart wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 11:54 am
Why don't Engineering Schools produce the same level of prestige for a University as Medical/Law/Veterinary?
MIT would like a word.

When I say "Engineering Schools" I meant like how USU has a College of Engineering, and now we have a College of Veterinary Medicine. The addition of the second one seemingly will instantly bring prestige just by existing. Same is true of medical and law schools. They're a big deal for some reason, but it doesn't seem like us having an engineering school makes that much of a difference. And it's not like there are way more universities offering graduate engineering degrees than doctors and lawyers. So, why does just about any school with a law/medical school get looked at as better than USU?

Yossarian · Post by **Yossarian** » July 22nd, 2022, 12:43 pm

BigBlueDart wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 11:54 am
Why don't Engineering Schools produce the same level of prestige for a University as Medical/Law/Veterinary?

There's a legacy hierarchy of higher education that persists. In times past - the "learned" fields of study were law, medicine, religion, and philosophy. Engineering and the physical sciences were considered more technical fields of study. I think this might have something to do with it.

Yossarian · Post by **Yossarian** » July 22nd, 2022, 12:54 pm

USU78 wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 10:33 am
Hallelujah!

Dental school next?

Animal dentistry?

bwcrc · Post by **bwcrc** » July 22nd, 2022, 1:35 pm

BigBlueDart wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 11:54 am
Why don't Engineering Schools produce the same level of prestige for a University as Medical/Law/Veterinary?

Because medicine and law have been around way longer as professions so their egos are generally bigger.

More seriously, I think part of it is there are currently 199 ABA accredited law schools in the country and 155 MD schools and another 38 DO schools. And each of these is a graduate degree only. According to the ASEE, there are 393 engineering programs in the US as of 2018 that offer a bachelor's master's, or doctoral engineering degree. So there are about an equal number of engineering programs in the country as there are combined law and medical programs.

(Yes, we probably need more medical schools and fewer law schools. Since I graduated from law school in 2006 there has been a new law school approved about every 18 months on average.)

Intermeddler · Post by **Intermeddler** » July 22nd, 2022, 3:14 pm

bwcrc wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 1:35 pm

BigBlueDart wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 11:54 am
Why don't Engineering Schools produce the same level of prestige for a University as Medical/Law/Veterinary?
Because medicine and law have been around way longer as professions so their egos are generally bigger.

More seriously, I think part of it is there are currently 199 ABA accredited law schools in the country and 155 MD schools and another 38 DO schools. And each of these is a graduate degree only. According to the ASEE, there are 393 engineering programs in the US as of 2018 that offer a bachelor's master's, or doctoral engineering degree. So there are about an equal number of engineering programs in the country as there are combined law and medical programs.

(Yes, we probably need more medical schools and fewer law schools. Since I graduated from law school in 2006 there has been a new law school approved about every 18 months on average.)

Agreed. Someone can correct me if I’m wrong about how engineering careers work but I imagine engineering is viewed more like accounting in that it’s well respected but you can have a successful career without a graduate degree in that field whereas Law and Medicine generally require a professional degree to practice.

Yossarian · Post by **Yossarian** » July 22nd, 2022, 3:41 pm

Intermeddler wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 3:14 pm

bwcrc wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 1:35 pm

BigBlueDart wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 11:54 am
Why don't Engineering Schools produce the same level of prestige for a University as Medical/Law/Veterinary?
Because medicine and law have been around way longer as professions so their egos are generally bigger.

More seriously, I think part of it is there are currently 199 ABA accredited law schools in the country and 155 MD schools and another 38 DO schools. And each of these is a graduate degree only. According to the ASEE, there are 393 engineering programs in the US as of 2018 that offer a bachelor's master's, or doctoral engineering degree. So there are about an equal number of engineering programs in the country as there are combined law and medical programs.

(Yes, we probably need more medical schools and fewer law schools. Since I graduated from law school in 2006 there has been a new law school approved about every 18 months on average.)
Agreed. Someone can correct me if I’m wrong about how engineering careers work but I imagine engineering is viewed more like accounting in that it’s well respected but you can have a successful career without a graduate degree in that field whereas Law and Medicine generally require a professional degree to practice.

An advanced degree is not required to work as an engineer. In fact, one could do "engineering" work without even having a degree at all. It must be done under the direction of a professional engineer that would assume responsibility of the work by stamping or signing the documents as a licensed professional engineer.

To become a professional engineer (PE), one must obtain a degree from an accredited university or engineering program, pass an 8-hour engineer-in-training (EIT) exam, work for 4 years as an EIT under the supervision of a professional engineer (3 years if you get a master's degree), apply for and pass an 8-hour national professional engineer (PE) exam, pass a state-specific laws and ethics exam, and then submit transcripts, letters of recommendation, and exam scores to the state board of professional licensing for which you are applying for professional licensure. When I was at USU, passing the EIT exam was a requirement for graduation as an engineer.

Some states (like California) require more exams for licensure. You must also pass a fundamentals of surveying and a seismic design exam to become a civil engineer here.

This is the basic process for most engineering disciplines. Some may require more exams. Some states require continuing education credits to maintain an active license. These can be obtained through attendance at professional conferences or classes at universities and the like.

Slim80 · Post by **Slim80** » July 22nd, 2022, 4:49 pm

Yossarian wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 3:41 pm

Intermeddler wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 3:14 pm

bwcrc wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 1:35 pm

BigBlueDart wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 11:54 am
Why don't Engineering Schools produce the same level of prestige for a University as Medical/Law/Veterinary?
Because medicine and law have been around way longer as professions so their egos are generally bigger.

More seriously, I think part of it is there are currently 199 ABA accredited law schools in the country and 155 MD schools and another 38 DO schools. And each of these is a graduate degree only. According to the ASEE, there are 393 engineering programs in the US as of 2018 that offer a bachelor's master's, or doctoral engineering degree. So there are about an equal number of engineering programs in the country as there are combined law and medical programs.

(Yes, we probably need more medical schools and fewer law schools. Since I graduated from law school in 2006 there has been a new law school approved about every 18 months on average.)
Agreed. Someone can correct me if I’m wrong about how engineering careers work but I imagine engineering is viewed more like accounting in that it’s well respected but you can have a successful career without a graduate degree in that field whereas Law and Medicine generally require a professional degree to practice.
An advanced degree is not required to work as an engineer. In fact, one could do "engineering" work without even having a degree at all. It must be done under the direction of a professional engineer that would assume responsibility of the work by stamping or signing the documents as a licensed professional engineer.

To become a professional engineer (PE), one must obtain a degree from an accredited university or engineering program, pass an 8-hour engineer-in-training (EIT) exam, work for 4 years as an EIT under the supervision of a professional engineer (3 years if you get a master's degree), apply for and pass an 8-hour national professional engineer (PE) exam, pass a state-specific laws and ethics exam, and then submit transcripts, letters of recommendation, and exam scores to the state board of professional licensing for which you are applying for professional licensure. When I was at USU, passing the EIT exam was a requirement for graduation as an engineer.

Some states (like California) require more exams for licensure. You must also pass a fundamentals of surveying and a seismic design exam to become a civil engineer here.

This is the basic process for most engineering disciplines. Some may require more exams. Some states require continuing education credits to maintain an active license. These can be obtained through attendance at professional conferences or classes at universities and the like.

Graduate level engineering degrees are required by some companies who specialize in specific areas of work i.e. structural engineering. The company I work for will not hire an engineer if there is not at least a masters degree. BUT in general, Yossarian is correct.

Does anyone know if there is a breakdown research grant values the different departments bring in? I’ve got to think that the physical sciences/engineering departments at USU bring in a substantial amount of money.

Intermeddler · Post by **Intermeddler** » July 22nd, 2022, 4:58 pm

Yossarian wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 3:41 pm

Intermeddler wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 3:14 pm

bwcrc wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 1:35 pm

BigBlueDart wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 11:54 am
Why don't Engineering Schools produce the same level of prestige for a University as Medical/Law/Veterinary?
Because medicine and law have been around way longer as professions so their egos are generally bigger.

More seriously, I think part of it is there are currently 199 ABA accredited law schools in the country and 155 MD schools and another 38 DO schools. And each of these is a graduate degree only. According to the ASEE, there are 393 engineering programs in the US as of 2018 that offer a bachelor's master's, or doctoral engineering degree. So there are about an equal number of engineering programs in the country as there are combined law and medical programs.

(Yes, we probably need more medical schools and fewer law schools. Since I graduated from law school in 2006 there has been a new law school approved about every 18 months on average.)
Agreed. Someone can correct me if I’m wrong about how engineering careers work but I imagine engineering is viewed more like accounting in that it’s well respected but you can have a successful career without a graduate degree in that field whereas Law and Medicine generally require a professional degree to practice.
An advanced degree is not required to work as an engineer. In fact, one could do "engineering" work without even having a degree at all. It must be done under the direction of a professional engineer that would assume responsibility of the work by stamping or signing the documents as a licensed professional engineer.

To become a professional engineer (PE), one must obtain a degree from an accredited university or engineering program, pass an 8-hour engineer-in-training (EIT) exam, work for 4 years as an EIT under the supervision of a professional engineer (3 years if you get a master's degree), apply for and pass an 8-hour national professional engineer (PE) exam, pass a state-specific laws and ethics exam, and then submit transcripts, letters of recommendation, and exam scores to the state board of professional licensing for which you are applying for professional licensure. When I was at USU, passing the EIT exam was a requirement for graduation as an engineer.

Some states (like California) require more exams for licensure. You must also pass a fundamentals of surveying and a seismic design exam to become a civil engineer here.

This is the basic process for most engineering disciplines. Some may require more exams. Some states require continuing education credits to maintain an active license. These can be obtained through attendance at professional conferences or classes at universities and the like.

Interesting. Thanks for the explanation.

bwcrc · Post by **bwcrc** » July 22nd, 2022, 5:06 pm

I do know that USU produces some of the best dam engineers. Sorry, I mean hydraulic or hydrologic engineers. Gannett Flemming is headquartered near me and has hired a number of USU grads over the last few years, each of them focusing on dams and bridges. At least one was involved with the review they did on the Oroville Dam failure.

Imakeitrain · Post by **Imakeitrain** » July 23rd, 2022, 2:51 pm

My dad went to Rensselaer, their sports teams are "the Engineers".

Anyway, Engineers make more than people think and many lawyers make less than people think.

I cant think of a better degree than Engineering and other related STEM fields such as computer science or physics. One of the best ways to mitigate the hurdle of not going to a top tier law school for lawyers is to have an engineering degree. Patent lawyers make phenomenal money. Whereas the Poli Sci major who went to a middle of the road law school may not have made the strongest investment.

I just dont think that engineers are typically as focused on donating to schools and schmoozing as lawyers are. I think that has hurt the engineering brand in terms of public's perception of "prestige".

But that is my perspective being neither.

LarryTheAggie · Post by **LarryTheAggie** » July 23rd, 2022, 6:44 pm

bwcrc wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 5:06 pm
I do know that USU produces some of the best dam engineers. Sorry, I mean hydraulic or hydrologic engineers. Gannett Flemming is headquartered near me and has hired a number of USU grads over the last few years, each of them focusing on dams and bridges. At least one was involved with the review they did on the Oroville Dam failure.

My dad was a Dam engineer. I want on so many Dam tours growing up. Then he got a new job in water treatment. Let's just say that I liked the Fam tours better, water treatment tours are pretty crappy.

TheAKAggie · Post by **TheAKAggie** » July 24th, 2022, 4:01 pm

Yossarian wrote:
Intermeddler wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 3:14 pm

bwcrc wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 1:35 pm

BigBlueDart wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 11:54 am
Why don't Engineering Schools produce the same level of prestige for a University as Medical/Law/Veterinary?
Because medicine and law have been around way longer as professions so their egos are generally bigger.

More seriously, I think part of it is there are currently 199 ABA accredited law schools in the country and 155 MD schools and another 38 DO schools. And each of these is a graduate degree only. According to the ASEE, there are 393 engineering programs in the US as of 2018 that offer a bachelor's master's, or doctoral engineering degree. So there are about an equal number of engineering programs in the country as there are combined law and medical programs.

(Yes, we probably need more medical schools and fewer law schools. Since I graduated from law school in 2006 there has been a new law school approved about every 18 months on average.)
Agreed. Someone can correct me if I’m wrong about how engineering careers work but I imagine engineering is viewed more like accounting in that it’s well respected but you can have a successful career without a graduate degree in that field whereas Law and Medicine generally require a professional degree to practice.
An advanced degree is not required to work as an engineer. In fact, one could do "engineering" work without even having a degree at all. It must be done under the direction of a professional engineer that would assume responsibility of the work by stamping or signing the documents as a licensed professional engineer.

To become a professional engineer (PE), one must obtain a degree from an accredited university or engineering program, pass an 8-hour engineer-in-training (EIT) exam, work for 4 years as an EIT under the supervision of a professional engineer (3 years if you get a master's degree), apply for and pass an 8-hour national professional engineer (PE) exam, pass a state-specific laws and ethics exam, and then submit transcripts, letters of recommendation, and exam scores to the state board of professional licensing for which you are applying for professional licensure. When I was at USU, passing the EIT exam was a requirement for graduation as an engineer.

Some states (like California) require more exams for licensure. You must also pass a fundamentals of surveying and a seismic design exam to become a civil engineer here.

This is the basic process for most engineering disciplines. Some may require more exams. Some states require continuing education credits to maintain an active license. These can be obtained through attendance at professional conferences or classes at universities and the like.

I do engineering work and I have BS in History. Now I don’t have a stamp or anything, but I find a large portion of my job is fixing and engineers design and sending it back to him for a rubber stamp.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

LKGates · Post by **LKGates** » July 27th, 2022, 12:25 am

TheAKAggie wrote: ↑
July 24th, 2022, 4:01 pm

Yossarian wrote:
Intermeddler wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 3:14 pm

bwcrc wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 1:35 pm

BigBlueDart wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 11:54 am
Why don't Engineering Schools produce the same level of prestige for a University as Medical/Law/Veterinary?
Because medicine and law have been around way longer as professions so their egos are generally bigger.

More seriously, I think part of it is there are currently 199 ABA accredited law schools in the country and 155 MD schools and another 38 DO schools. And each of these is a graduate degree only. According to the ASEE, there are 393 engineering programs in the US as of 2018 that offer a bachelor's master's, or doctoral engineering degree. So there are about an equal number of engineering programs in the country as there are combined law and medical programs.

(Yes, we probably need more medical schools and fewer law schools. Since I graduated from law school in 2006 there has been a new law school approved about every 18 months on average.)
Agreed. Someone can correct me if I’m wrong about how engineering careers work but I imagine engineering is viewed more like accounting in that it’s well respected but you can have a successful career without a graduate degree in that field whereas Law and Medicine generally require a professional degree to practice.
An advanced degree is not required to work as an engineer. In fact, one could do "engineering" work without even having a degree at all. It must be done under the direction of a professional engineer that would assume responsibility of the work by stamping or signing the documents as a licensed professional engineer.

To become a professional engineer (PE), one must obtain a degree from an accredited university or engineering program, pass an 8-hour engineer-in-training (EIT) exam, work for 4 years as an EIT under the supervision of a professional engineer (3 years if you get a master's degree), apply for and pass an 8-hour national professional engineer (PE) exam, pass a state-specific laws and ethics exam, and then submit transcripts, letters of recommendation, and exam scores to the state board of professional licensing for which you are applying for professional licensure. When I was at USU, passing the EIT exam was a requirement for graduation as an engineer.

Some states (like California) require more exams for licensure. You must also pass a fundamentals of surveying and a seismic design exam to become a civil engineer here.

This is the basic process for most engineering disciplines. Some may require more exams. Some states require continuing education credits to maintain an active license. These can be obtained through attendance at professional conferences or classes at universities and the like.
I do engineering work and I have BS in History. Now I don’t have a stamp or anything, but I find a large portion of my job is fixing and engineers design and sending it back to him for a rubber stamp.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Just to be clear, is that really a BS in History, or a history of BS?

bwcrc · Post by **bwcrc** » July 27th, 2022, 6:44 am

LKGates wrote: ↑
July 27th, 2022, 12:25 am

TheAKAggie wrote: ↑
July 24th, 2022, 4:01 pm

Yossarian wrote:
Intermeddler wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 3:14 pm

bwcrc wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 1:35 pm

BigBlueDart wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 11:54 am
Why don't Engineering Schools produce the same level of prestige for a University as Medical/Law/Veterinary?
Because medicine and law have been around way longer as professions so their egos are generally bigger.

More seriously, I think part of it is there are currently 199 ABA accredited law schools in the country and 155 MD schools and another 38 DO schools. And each of these is a graduate degree only. According to the ASEE, there are 393 engineering programs in the US as of 2018 that offer a bachelor's master's, or doctoral engineering degree. So there are about an equal number of engineering programs in the country as there are combined law and medical programs.

(Yes, we probably need more medical schools and fewer law schools. Since I graduated from law school in 2006 there has been a new law school approved about every 18 months on average.)
Agreed. Someone can correct me if I’m wrong about how engineering careers work but I imagine engineering is viewed more like accounting in that it’s well respected but you can have a successful career without a graduate degree in that field whereas Law and Medicine generally require a professional degree to practice.
An advanced degree is not required to work as an engineer. In fact, one could do "engineering" work without even having a degree at all. It must be done under the direction of a professional engineer that would assume responsibility of the work by stamping or signing the documents as a licensed professional engineer.

To become a professional engineer (PE), one must obtain a degree from an accredited university or engineering program, pass an 8-hour engineer-in-training (EIT) exam, work for 4 years as an EIT under the supervision of a professional engineer (3 years if you get a master's degree), apply for and pass an 8-hour national professional engineer (PE) exam, pass a state-specific laws and ethics exam, and then submit transcripts, letters of recommendation, and exam scores to the state board of professional licensing for which you are applying for professional licensure. When I was at USU, passing the EIT exam was a requirement for graduation as an engineer.

Some states (like California) require more exams for licensure. You must also pass a fundamentals of surveying and a seismic design exam to become a civil engineer here.

This is the basic process for most engineering disciplines. Some may require more exams. Some states require continuing education credits to maintain an active license. These can be obtained through attendance at professional conferences or classes at universities and the like.
I do engineering work and I have BS in History. Now I don’t have a stamp or anything, but I find a large portion of my job is fixing and engineers design and sending it back to him for a rubber stamp.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Just to be clear, is that really a BS in History, or a history of BS?

Probably both. Although he hasn't finished yet with his history of BS, he is on track to graduate with high honors.

TheAKAggie · Post by **TheAKAggie** » July 27th, 2022, 8:05 am

LKGates wrote:
TheAKAggie wrote: ↑
July 24th, 2022, 4:01 pm

Yossarian wrote:
Intermeddler wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 3:14 pm

bwcrc wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 1:35 pm

BigBlueDart wrote: ↑
July 22nd, 2022, 11:54 am
Why don't Engineering Schools produce the same level of prestige for a University as Medical/Law/Veterinary?
Because medicine and law have been around way longer as professions so their egos are generally bigger.

More seriously, I think part of it is there are currently 199 ABA accredited law schools in the country and 155 MD schools and another 38 DO schools. And each of these is a graduate degree only. According to the ASEE, there are 393 engineering programs in the US as of 2018 that offer a bachelor's master's, or doctoral engineering degree. So there are about an equal number of engineering programs in the country as there are combined law and medical programs.

(Yes, we probably need more medical schools and fewer law schools. Since I graduated from law school in 2006 there has been a new law school approved about every 18 months on average.)
Agreed. Someone can correct me if I’m wrong about how engineering careers work but I imagine engineering is viewed more like accounting in that it’s well respected but you can have a successful career without a graduate degree in that field whereas Law and Medicine generally require a professional degree to practice.
An advanced degree is not required to work as an engineer. In fact, one could do "engineering" work without even having a degree at all. It must be done under the direction of a professional engineer that would assume responsibility of the work by stamping or signing the documents as a licensed professional engineer.

To become a professional engineer (PE), one must obtain a degree from an accredited university or engineering program, pass an 8-hour engineer-in-training (EIT) exam, work for 4 years as an EIT under the supervision of a professional engineer (3 years if you get a master's degree), apply for and pass an 8-hour national professional engineer (PE) exam, pass a state-specific laws and ethics exam, and then submit transcripts, letters of recommendation, and exam scores to the state board of professional licensing for which you are applying for professional licensure. When I was at USU, passing the EIT exam was a requirement for graduation as an engineer.

Some states (like California) require more exams for licensure. You must also pass a fundamentals of surveying and a seismic design exam to become a civil engineer here.

This is the basic process for most engineering disciplines. Some may require more exams. Some states require continuing education credits to maintain an active license. These can be obtained through attendance at professional conferences or classes at universities and the like.
I do engineering work and I have BS in History. Now I don’t have a stamp or anything, but I find a large portion of my job is fixing and engineers design and sending it back to him for a rubber stamp.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Just to be clear, is that really a BS in History, or a history of BS?

I am proficient on both accounts.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

TheAKAggie · Post by **TheAKAggie** » July 27th, 2022, 8:08 am

bwcrc wrote:
Because medicine and law have been around way longer as professions so their egos are generally bigger.

If we’re looking for some prestige I saw we start a school focusing on the oldest profession.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

BigBlueDart · Post by **BigBlueDart** » July 27th, 2022, 8:43 am

TheAKAggie wrote: ↑
July 27th, 2022, 8:08 am

bwcrc wrote:
Because medicine and law have been around way longer as professions so their egos are generally bigger.
If we’re looking for some prestige I saw we start a school focusing on the oldest profession.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Prostitution?

3rdGenAggie · Post by **3rdGenAggie** » July 27th, 2022, 9:20 am

TheAKAggie wrote: ↑
July 27th, 2022, 8:08 am

bwcrc wrote:
Because medicine and law have been around way longer as professions so their egos are generally bigger.
If we’re looking for some prestige I saw we start a school focusing on the oldest profession.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm not sure a degree in that will increase one's earning potential much.

LKGates · Post by **LKGates** » July 28th, 2022, 12:55 pm

TheAKAggie wrote: ↑
July 27th, 2022, 8:08 am

bwcrc wrote:
Because medicine and law have been around way longer as professions so their egos are generally bigger.
If we’re looking for some prestige I saw we start a school focusing on the oldest profession.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Maybe we could do something similar to what the vet school did with WSU. The kids could do their first two strictly classroom years in Logan, then go to Boise State for their last two clinical years. Because you know, truck stops....

USU78 · Post by **USU78** » July 28th, 2022, 1:30 pm

LKGates wrote: ↑
July 28th, 2022, 12:55 pm

TheAKAggie wrote: ↑
July 27th, 2022, 8:08 am

bwcrc wrote:Because medicine and law have been around way longer as professions so their egos are generally bigger.
If we’re looking for some prestige I saw we start a school focusing on the oldest profession.
Maybe we could do something similar to what the vet school did with WSU. The kids could do their first two strictly classroom years in Logan, then go to Boise State for their last two clinical years. Because you know, truck stops....

StanfordAggie · Post by **StanfordAggie** » August 14th, 2022, 11:09 pm

3rdGenAggie wrote: ↑
July 27th, 2022, 9:20 am

TheAKAggie wrote: ↑
July 27th, 2022, 8:08 am

bwcrc wrote:
Because medicine and law have been around way longer as professions so their egos are generally bigger.
If we’re looking for some prestige I saw we start a school focusing on the oldest profession.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I'm not sure a degree in that will increase one's earning potential much.

The Economist (the news magazine) once performed a study where they want to a popular site for sex workers, collected data on each woman on the site, and then tried to see which characteristics were predictive of higher earnings. Some of them were not surprising. Other things being equal, white women earned more. Thinner women also earned more, but only up to a certain point. Apparently guys don't actually like the anorexia look.

The finding that was most surprising to me, however, was that sex workers with college degrees earned far more than sex workers without a college degree. Indeed, the percentage increase in earnings was comparable to the increase in earnings that college-educated women obtain in other fields.

So in actuality, at least one study indicates that having a degree actually will increase one's earnings as a sex worker. However, the question of whether a degree in prostitution increases one's earnings more than some random history or political science degree is still unknown.

dogie · Post by **dogie** » August 14th, 2022, 11:17 pm

Imakeitrain wrote: ↑
July 23rd, 2022, 2:51 pm
My dad went to Rensselaer, their sports teams are "the Engineers".

Anyway, Engineers make more than people think and many lawyers make less than people think.

I cant think of a better degree than Engineering and other related STEM fields such as computer science or physics. One of the best ways to mitigate the hurdle of not going to a top tier law school for lawyers is to have an engineering degree. Patent lawyers make phenomenal money. Whereas the Poli Sci major who went to a middle of the road law school may not have made the strongest investment.

I just dont think that engineers are typically as focused on donating to schools and schmoozing as lawyers are. I think that has hurt the engineering brand in terms of public's perception of "prestige".

But that is my perspective being neither.

As a patent attorney with a USU engineering degree, I can attest to everything you have said here.

utkyag · Post by **utkyag** » August 16th, 2022, 12:54 am

My dad was a chemical engineer for Seagram's Distilleries in Lawrenceburg and Louisville, Kentucky. I grew up on Seagram's property in Lawrenceburg. On Saturdays when my dad would work in the plant, he would let my brother and myself follow him around (I am a downwinder...but a little different than the folks in southern Utah). He redesigned the distillation system (still have his hand drawn schematics) to improve the output and quality of the bourbon. He also designed the gold foil wrap that is around the neck of the bottles of some of the different brands of bourbon. The folks in the corporate offices in New York City wanted him to work there. He tried it for a couple of months and decided he didn't want to raise a family in or near New York City. He told corporate he would be happy to stay in Louisville. They let him go because he didn't want to work in the corporate offices. Seagrams did use his schematic as a mural in the lobby of their corporate offices for several years. Thiokol was hiring at the time he was let go, so he went from booze to propellant development.....pretty much the same chemistry.

jpswensen · Post by **jpswensen** » August 16th, 2022, 1:32 pm

I wonder how this will affect our church congregation here in Pullman. We often get 4-10 families each year that come to WSU for their final 2 years.

I talked with a current vet and he thinks the following:

1. WSU will still be higher ranked than USU for quite a while (or maybe forever). He also said that USU doesn't originally have plans for a full veterinary hospital. As such, he expects that top students who are interested in general practice (rather than large animals) will still apply to WSU and have USU as a backup school.
2. He said there is currently a large shortage of veterinarians, and that both USU and WSU could likely fill entire classes without a problem. We may get less people from UT, ID, WY coming, but when they do come it will be for the full 4 years instead of 2 at USU and 2 at WSU.
3. He also suspects that there may be a restructuring of WIMU program and isn't sure whether there will be dueling WIMU-like programs offered by both USU and WSU.

Aggie_CEE · Post by **Aggie_CEE** » August 17th, 2022, 7:39 am

Imakeitrain wrote: ↑
July 23rd, 2022, 2:51 pm
My dad went to Rensselaer, their sports teams are "the Engineers".

Anyway, Engineers make more than people think and many lawyers make less than people think.

I cant think of a better degree than Engineering and other related STEM fields such as computer science or physics. One of the best ways to mitigate the hurdle of not going to a top tier law school for lawyers is to have an engineering degree. Patent lawyers make phenomenal money. Whereas the Poli Sci major who went to a middle of the road law school may not have made the strongest investment.

I just dont think that engineers are typically as focused on donating to schools and schmoozing as lawyers are. I think that has hurt the engineering brand in terms of public's perception of "prestige".

But that is my perspective being neither.

I'm a licensed professional engineer and it surprised me how little PEs actually make. It's not terrible, but I'll be fighting to pass 100k once I hit the 10 year mark.

USUMAE · Post by **USUMAE** » August 17th, 2022, 4:26 pm

Aggie_CEE wrote: ↑
August 17th, 2022, 7:39 am

Imakeitrain wrote: ↑
July 23rd, 2022, 2:51 pm
My dad went to Rensselaer, their sports teams are "the Engineers".

Anyway, Engineers make more than people think and many lawyers make less than people think.

I cant think of a better degree than Engineering and other related STEM fields such as computer science or physics. One of the best ways to mitigate the hurdle of not going to a top tier law school for lawyers is to have an engineering degree. Patent lawyers make phenomenal money. Whereas the Poli Sci major who went to a middle of the road law school may not have made the strongest investment.

I just dont think that engineers are typically as focused on donating to schools and schmoozing as lawyers are. I think that has hurt the engineering brand in terms of public's perception of "prestige".

But that is my perspective being neither.
I'm a licensed professional engineer and it surprised me how little PEs actually make. It's not terrible, but I'll be fighting to pass 100k once I hit the 10 year mark.

I’ll have my PE in October and I’m wondering if I ought to stay in MEP or bail. There’s something to be said of the stability, even if the money isn’t great.

Post by **Aglicious** » August 17th, 2022, 5:42 pm

Aggie_CEE wrote: ↑
August 17th, 2022, 7:39 am

Imakeitrain wrote: ↑
July 23rd, 2022, 2:51 pm
My dad went to Rensselaer, their sports teams are "the Engineers".

Anyway, Engineers make more than people think and many lawyers make less than people think.

I cant think of a better degree than Engineering and other related STEM fields such as computer science or physics. One of the best ways to mitigate the hurdle of not going to a top tier law school for lawyers is to have an engineering degree. Patent lawyers make phenomenal money. Whereas the Poli Sci major who went to a middle of the road law school may not have made the strongest investment.

I just dont think that engineers are typically as focused on donating to schools and schmoozing as lawyers are. I think that has hurt the engineering brand in terms of public's perception of "prestige".

But that is my perspective being neither.
I'm a licensed professional engineer and it surprised me how little PEs actually make. It's not terrible, but I'll be fighting to pass 100k once I hit the 10 year mark.

You back east? or west? Like most occupations I think there is a higher pay rate associated with both Cali and the East Coast. While the lowest average rates are always found in the inter-mountain area states. I have hired quite a few licensed design professionals over the past 15 years or so and I find it increasingly shocking how much they want to be paid. I have had kids in interviews that have less than 5 years experience (but are licensed) that want 100K/yr. I just have to laugh. I'm left to wonder what they are told in school to expect for a top salary. If that's what they expect at year 5 or even 10 there's nowhere to go from there. What kind of increases can be expected over the remainder of their 35+ year career?

Anyway, back to the topic....go future vets!

bwcrc · Post by **bwcrc** » August 17th, 2022, 6:12 pm

Aglicious wrote: ↑
August 17th, 2022, 5:42 pm

Aggie_CEE wrote: ↑
August 17th, 2022, 7:39 am

Imakeitrain wrote: ↑
July 23rd, 2022, 2:51 pm
My dad went to Rensselaer, their sports teams are "the Engineers".

Anyway, Engineers make more than people think and many lawyers make less than people think.

I cant think of a better degree than Engineering and other related STEM fields such as computer science or physics. One of the best ways to mitigate the hurdle of not going to a top tier law school for lawyers is to have an engineering degree. Patent lawyers make phenomenal money. Whereas the Poli Sci major who went to a middle of the road law school may not have made the strongest investment.

I just dont think that engineers are typically as focused on donating to schools and schmoozing as lawyers are. I think that has hurt the engineering brand in terms of public's perception of "prestige".

But that is my perspective being neither.
I'm a licensed professional engineer and it surprised me how little PEs actually make. It's not terrible, but I'll be fighting to pass 100k once I hit the 10 year mark.
You back east? or west? Like most occupations I think there is a higher pay rate associated with both Cali and the East Coast. While the lowest average rates are always found in the inter-mountain area states. I have hired quite a few licensed design professionals over the past 15 years or so and I find it increasingly shocking how much they want to be paid. I have had kids in interviews that have less than 5 years experience (but are licensed) that want 100K/yr. I just have to laugh. I'm left to wonder what they are told in school to expect for a top salary. If that's what they expect at year 5 or even 10 there's nowhere to go from there. What kind of increases can be expected over the remainder of their 35+ year career?

Anyway, back to the topic....go future vets!

Yeah, lawyers don't make nearly as much as most people expect. When I did an internship at the state court in Logan as an undergrad close to 20 years ago, there was a single law clerk for the judges. I forget where he went to law school (somewhere in the Midwest I think) but I remember him saying how there were some firms in Idaho that offered him $25k as a starting salary and acting like they were doing him a favor. An attorney I know in Pennsylvania coming out of Ohio State in 2004 landed a job at the awesome salary of $35k a year. I know plenty of attorneys in private practice who don't break $100k for at least 10 years. Yes, there are some lawyer jobs with great salaries but those generally also require selling your soul to stick with them.

BigBlueDart · Post by **BigBlueDart** » August 18th, 2022, 9:58 am

bwcrc wrote: ↑
August 17th, 2022, 6:12 pm
Yes, there are some lawyer jobs with great salaries but those generally also require selling your soul to stick with them.

I had no idea my soul was worth that much! Do you think I could just take out an equity loan, instead?

Intermeddler · Post by **Intermeddler** » August 18th, 2022, 1:25 pm

bwcrc wrote: ↑
August 17th, 2022, 6:12 pm

Aglicious wrote: ↑
August 17th, 2022, 5:42 pm

Aggie_CEE wrote: ↑
August 17th, 2022, 7:39 am

Imakeitrain wrote: ↑
July 23rd, 2022, 2:51 pm
My dad went to Rensselaer, their sports teams are "the Engineers".

Anyway, Engineers make more than people think and many lawyers make less than people think.

I cant think of a better degree than Engineering and other related STEM fields such as computer science or physics. One of the best ways to mitigate the hurdle of not going to a top tier law school for lawyers is to have an engineering degree. Patent lawyers make phenomenal money. Whereas the Poli Sci major who went to a middle of the road law school may not have made the strongest investment.

I just dont think that engineers are typically as focused on donating to schools and schmoozing as lawyers are. I think that has hurt the engineering brand in terms of public's perception of "prestige".

But that is my perspective being neither.
I'm a licensed professional engineer and it surprised me how little PEs actually make. It's not terrible, but I'll be fighting to pass 100k once I hit the 10 year mark.
You back east? or west? Like most occupations I think there is a higher pay rate associated with both Cali and the East Coast. While the lowest average rates are always found in the inter-mountain area states. I have hired quite a few licensed design professionals over the past 15 years or so and I find it increasingly shocking how much they want to be paid. I have had kids in interviews that have less than 5 years experience (but are licensed) that want 100K/yr. I just have to laugh. I'm left to wonder what they are told in school to expect for a top salary. If that's what they expect at year 5 or even 10 there's nowhere to go from there. What kind of increases can be expected over the remainder of their 35+ year career?

Anyway, back to the topic....go future vets!
Yeah, lawyers don't make nearly as much as most people expect. When I did an internship at the state court in Logan as an undergrad close to 20 years ago, there was a single law clerk for the judges. I forget where he went to law school (somewhere in the Midwest I think) but I remember him saying how there were some firms in Idaho that offered him $25k as a starting salary and acting like they were doing him a favor. An attorney I know in Pennsylvania coming out of Ohio State in 2004 landed a job at the awesome salary of $35k a year. I know plenty of attorneys in private practice who don't break $100k for at least 10 years. Yes, there are some lawyer jobs with great salaries but those generally also require selling your soul to stick with them.

There is a lot of truth to this, but I think that is mostly because people get very skewed impressions of what lawyers make based on limited interactions, fictional accounts on TV, etc. or they see the hourly rate they get charged if they ever engage a lawyer and do rudimentary math and extrapolate that to a large income despite not knowing how many hours that person can collect at that rate and their overhead costs, which is why I would say some lawyers not "lawyers" as many make exactly what people would assume, or much more.

There are plenty of attorneys in private practice who do not break $100,000 for that long, but there are also plenty that make far more than that right out of law school. My firm offers 1st year associates at $155,000 and we are typical for firms our size in the SLC market. Bigger firms offer $180,000 and especially large firms over $200,000 (though the hours required by those firms could be considered selling your soul which I honestly wouldn't say about any of the local or regional firms any longer).

It really depends on what you do and where you do it. I graduated from law school in 2013 and those that work government jobs or in smaller areas probably make less than $100,000 or just over. Those that have made partner in larger firms make $500,000+. A firm that would be considered "large" in Logan offered a classmate of mine about $40,000 with no benefits so it really depends.

Upcoming Events

Event Results