I understand that Wells contract runs through end of calendar year 2019. Hartwell did not extend this contract when Wells stock was low and performance was mediocre. Now, with a breakout season, I wonder what Hartwell's strategy with his contract. Assuming things play as they have, we likely end with a 9 or 10 wins (not counting a bowl game) and the big leagues will come calling for Wells services.

If you are Hartwell, do you try to extend the contract now - before the end of the year or let it play out? I think the buyout for Wells if it occurs before the last game of 2019 is $800k. I think we need to extend his contract with a total comp package of ~$1.5 / year and increase the buyout (assuming we can afford it).

If I am Wells, I don't negotiate the contract until end of the season when all offers have made themselves available.

Thoughts on this?

He can sign now and not risk somethings going wrong the rest of the way. Then he can still weigh any offers that come at the end of the year. At least we would get a bigger buy out under your scenario.

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Hartwell should simply say "we want to extend you, but don't want to take away from the work you're doing with this team. How would you like to handle it? Should I start discussions with your representation or should I wait until after the season?"

If I were a coach, I wouldn't want the distraction of contract negotiations while I'm in the middle of a season. In fact, I think it would piss me off if my AD tried to force it mid-season. But that's just me.

brownjeans wrote: ↑

October 8th, 2018, 9:08 pm

Hartwell should simply say "we want to extend you, but don't want to take away from the work you're doing with this team. How would you like to handle it? Should I start discussions with your representation or should I wait until after the season?"

If I were a coach, I wouldn't want the distraction of contract negotiations while I'm in the middle of a season. In fact, I think it would piss me off if my AD tried to force it mid-season. But that's just me.

I don't know. If it was the busy time during my job and my boss tried to offer me a 50% wage increase, I think I'd be okay with that. He probably has a lawyer (hopefully better than Duryea's) looking over the contract for him anyway.

Everyone knows there is an extension coming. I think you could let it get out the negotiations have started then sign after the season to assure recruits that Logan is a special place, and he’s not leaving anytime soon.

I do wonder if seeing coaches like Rocky Long (Wells spent a couple years at New Mexico) and Calhoun having long careers at MW schools while also watching GA, and Weatherbie bounce around makes him think about staying. He would be a coordinator if he had a similar record at a P5 school as he has had at Utah State (Oregon is an example). I wouldn’t blame him for leaving, but he could likely have a long secure career with a lot less stress at USU after the drop off and rebuilding he’s done. Also, he has earned a new contract.

I want to raise and extend the assistants.

Coaches have agents at this level.


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In 2012, Barnes announced Gary's extension in October. That extension would have kept Gary here through the end of this season. He was gone about two months later.

brownjeans wrote: ↑

October 8th, 2018, 10:45 pm

I want to raise and extend the assistants.

Wells can make $1 million at USU, much of the success this season must also go to Coach Yost, and K.P. It would be great to keep all three in Logan. I do not want to lose them to another G-5 school.

I do not know where the additional revenue will come from with the attendance, and ticket prices being what they are hopeful some avenue will be open. At least $500 to $750,000 would be needed. Forget living in Logan as having a great selling point for keeping coach's it is good for some, but not everyone. It has many good things, but lack's in other's. Living in Logan is not worth losing $250,000 per year.

For all intents and purposes, Wells already makes $1 million a year at USU.

If a big contract comes he is gone. I have seen enough to know how this plays out. I hope we have a season that takes the sting away.

oleblu111 wrote: ↑

October 9th, 2018, 12:58 pm

Wells can make $1 million at USU, much of the success this season must also go to Coach Yost, and K.P. It would be great to keep all three in Logan. I do not want to lose them to another G-5 school.

Kenny Powers?

MalAgua wrote: ↑

October 11th, 2018, 12:13 pm

oleblu111 wrote: ↑

October 9th, 2018, 12:58 pm

Wells can make $1 million at USU, much of the success this season must also go to Coach Yost, and K.P. It would be great to keep all three in Logan. I do not want to lose them to another G-5 school.

Kenny Powers?

Kitty Pryde

I am glad we didn't extend Wells when we did. I am glad that Wells has turned things around. I feel like too long of an extension allows complacency. Also, we need to fork out the $$ for assistants. If we want to compete with the likes of Boise State and other high-end G5 schools we need to pay our assistants what they are worth.

Also, if we are going to support the program through the highs and lows we need to consistently be contributing, not just when we are winning. This is why G5 schools with long term success keep winning. They have consistent support.

brownjeans wrote: ↑

October 8th, 2018, 10:45 pm

I want to raise and extend the assistants.

This is huge. Remember the year the coaching staff blew up? Brutal. Hurts recruiting and continuity. Since then, our staff has been stable, and things have been much better. If we can keep the staff together, it will help us be consistently good!

oleblu111 wrote: ↑

October 9th, 2018, 12:58 pm

brownjeans wrote: ↑

October 8th, 2018, 10:45 pm

I want to raise and extend the assistants.

Wells can make $1 million at USU, much of the success this season must also go to Coach Yost, and K.P. It would be great to keep all three in Logan. I do not want to lose them to another G-5 school.

I do not know where the additional revenue will come from with the attendance, and ticket prices being what they are hopeful some avenue will be open. At least $500 to $750,000 would be needed. Forget living in Logan as having a great selling point for keeping coach's it is good for some, but not everyone. It has many good things, but lack's in other's. Living in Logan is not worth losing $250,000 per year.

I just don't see any way we keep Yost on staff for next season. He's going to get some big offers.

swishh_15 wrote: ↑

October 23rd, 2018, 8:40 am

oleblu111 wrote: ↑

October 9th, 2018, 12:58 pm

brownjeans wrote: ↑

October 8th, 2018, 10:45 pm

I want to raise and extend the assistants.

Wells can make $1 million at USU, much of the success this season must also go to Coach Yost, and K.P. It would be great to keep all three in Logan. I do not want to lose them to another G-5 school.

I do not know where the additional revenue will come from with the attendance, and ticket prices being what they are hopeful some avenue will be open. At least $500 to $750,000 would be needed. Forget living in Logan as having a great selling point for keeping coach's it is good for some, but not everyone. It has many good things, but lack's in other's. Living in Logan is not worth losing $250,000 per year.

I just don't see any way we keep Yost on staff for next season. He's going to get some big offers.

I would say it depends on where some of these guys are in terms of their careers. Are they still going to chase the all mighty dollar? Younger guys I see that happening. But some of our coaches have already been around the block. What if they are content with minor raises and remaining at USU to continue building what they've started? I'm probably daydreaming though but it would be nice.

I get the impression Yost is more about his feeling of happiness than the pursuit of money and glory. I'm not saying he won't leave, but I agree with aggies22 that he has different motivations.
If Yost leaves, it won't simply be because of money or a higher-profile job. He's had those things and was unhappy with the pressure and work/life balance.

Plus he got that Power Ranger’s money!!!


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I'm all for this staff pushing as hard as they can to get the best outside offers possible. I don't want any extension offered mid season that could detract from their ultimate goal as being the most marketable coaches in America.

Has anyone thought about where this extra money to pay coach's going to come from ? $500,000 to a million more per year is not available when I look at the current athletic budget.

oleblu111 wrote: ↑

October 24th, 2018, 9:53 pm

Has anyone thought about where this extra money to pay coach's going to come from ? $500,000 to a million more per year is not available when I look at the current athletic budget.

Probably from the increased ticket sales.

Yes the $1,2 million USU made in football ticket sales in 2017 would increase to $ 2.5 million for the 2019 season, with Wells Yost and K.P. in place, of course at the current ticket price we would need to have a 35,000 seat stadium to get it done, should we start construction this spring ?

oleblu111 wrote: ↑

October 25th, 2018, 11:00 am

Yes the $1,2 million USU made in football ticket sales in 2017 would increase to $ 2.5 million for the 2019 season, with Wells Yost and K.P. in place, of course at the current ticket price we would need to have a 35,000 seat stadium to get it done, should we start construction this spring ?

Yes

oleblu111 wrote: ↑

October 24th, 2018, 9:53 pm

Has anyone thought about where this extra money to pay coach's going to come from ? $500,000 to a million more per year is not available when I look at the current athletic budget.

Doesn't a budget represent money for planned expenses, not how much money there is? For example: I have $100 in my pocket. I budget $10 for lunch. $10 is what I plan to spend for lunch. It's my lunch budget. I can stay within or go over that budget, but that budget doesn't represent how much money I actually have.

That is true however the money that USU athletic have comes from many pots, the largest one is University money, which is near $15 million per year which is the highest of all the state schools in Utah, if the $ 500,000 to $1 million increase was to happen that might be a source in fact it is the only way imho it could happen.

The budget I refer to is what was spent in 2017, the only way to spend more than what you bring in is to have the amount subsidized by the school with University funds. The question comes how much university money should USU spend to subsidize a program ? If the school is to increase the revenue input that money would come at the expense of some other interest. That can become a hot potato for Cockett. She is now spending as much in university funds as Utah and Weber combined.

Could USU pay these coach's what is needed ? The answer is yes, but is it the right investment is the $64 question

oleblu111 wrote: ↑

October 25th, 2018, 1:37 pm

That is true however the money that USU athletic have comes from many pots, the largest one is University money, which is near $15 million per year which is the highest of all the state schools in Utah, if the $ 500,000 to $1 million increase was to happen that might be a source in fact it is the only way imho it could happen.

The budget I refer to is what was spent in 2017, the only way to spend more than what you bring in is to have the amount subsidized by the school with University funds. The question comes how much university money should USU spend to subsidize a program? If the school is to increase the revenue input that money would come at the expense of some other interest. That can become a hot potato for Cockett.

Could USU pay these coach's what is needed? The answer is yes, but is it the right investment is the $64 question

You say the USU athletic budget comes from may pots, then you only argue about one pot. Seems like a red herring or maybe a strawman... maybe a fish dressed as a scarecrow? Or this?


Anyway, if your point is that we need stronger financial support for our programs, I think everyone knows that.

brownjeans wrote: Doesn't a budget represent money for planned expenses, not how much money there is? For example: I have $100 in my pocket. I budget $10 for lunch. $10 is what I plan to spend for lunch. It's my lunch budget. I can stay within or go over that budget, but that budget doesn't represent how much money I actually have.

Yes and no. Yes a budget is about planned expenditures. A budget usually has a starting balance and an ending balance showing the expected relationship between revenue and expenses. So USU has a pot of money, but it’s really unrelated to the Athletic budget. In order to give a raise to someone there would have to be an increase in revenues or moved from somewhere else in the budget. Using your example of a $100 budget. If you went out to lunch and spent $10 and also $50 to fill up the gas tank. After spending all your cash you get home and your wife ask for some cash to go out and you give her $30 you have then your kid ask for some cash to go out with friends. You want lunch tomorrow so you hang onto some of your cash. Sorry Jr. it’s not in the budget.

You just described my budget, except I don't end up spending any of it on my lunch.

USU is already spending more than it can afford on athletics in general and football in particular. There are no university related budgets left to raid. If we give raises it is going to have to come from donations, ticket sales, or some other type of outside funding (sponsors?), or some other source - I don't think it is in the cards.

I hope he gets a nice offer from someone else and that he takes it.

oleblu111 wrote: ↑

October 25th, 2018, 11:00 am

Yes the $1,2 million USU made in football ticket sales in 2017 would increase to $ 2.5 million for the 2019 season, with Wells Yost and K.P. in place, of course at the current ticket price we would need to have a 35,000 seat stadium to get it done, should we start construction this spring ?

How about immediately after we win the Mountain West Conference Championship on our home turf?