4th down

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4th down

Post by FloridaAggie13 » November 10th, 2019, 9:50 am

100% right decision, completely disagree with the play call.

We had only stopped FSU once in the 2nd half at that point so a FG giving us a 2 pt lead was too little of an advantage.

The play call was too predictable. Would rather see misdirection in that situation to take advantage of the D's propensity to be over aggressive on a 4th down all or nothing play at the goal line. BYUs WR screen in a similar situation last week is a good example. A lot more options than a slow developing handoff. How about going under center? Play action? Use pre snap motion to gain half a step or again, cause distraction.

Theatricality and Deception are indeed powerful agents and we could have used some in that situation.

Or, perhaps Sanford isn't a fan of the Dark Knight Trilogy.
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Re: 4th down

Post by aceofspadeskb » November 10th, 2019, 9:57 am

It baffles me that we refuse to play under center. I keep expecting to see it because it's part of Jordan Love's warm up routine. It's infuriating to start a 4th and inches with a 4 yard snap.

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Re: 4th down

Post by Blitz79 » November 10th, 2019, 11:56 am

I disagree. I would have gone for the field goal and the lead. You said it yourself, we couldn't stop them. With 5 minutes left if we get the lead with a field goal, then they go back and score then we get the ball back with a chance to win the game. Sure they could run the time down but at least we are within 1 score.

If we get stopped like we did and they go score a TD(remember we weren't stopping them) it's game over.

Thank goodness we got that 3rd down stop and ended up winning the game. But you take the point and the lead in that situation. It would be fun to have a what would you do in that scenario poll.
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Re: 4th down

Post by ususports » November 10th, 2019, 12:07 pm

Blitz79 wrote:
November 10th, 2019, 11:56 am
I disagree. I would have gone for the field goal and the lead. You said it yourself, we couldn't stop them. With 5 minutes left if we get the lead with a field goal, then they go back and score then we get the ball back with a chance to win the game. Sure they could run the time down but at least we are within 1 score.

If we get stopped like we did and they go score a TD(remember we weren't stopping them) it's game over.

Thank goodness we got that 3rd down stop and ended up winning the game. But you take the point and the lead in that situation. It would be fun to have a what would you do in that scenario poll.
Absolutely agree!



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Re: 4th down

Post by SasquatchAggie » November 10th, 2019, 12:19 pm

I agreed with going for it. The reason we ended up getting a stop right after that is because they had the lead and went conservative.
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Re: 4th down

Post by bullshot » November 10th, 2019, 12:52 pm

Going forward, any success we have will be in out scoring the oppositions offense. In other words, winning shootouts. I guess that would be appropriate for battle of the “Rifle” with Wyoming. After last night perhaps the Pokes are a little demoralized.



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Re: 4th down

Post by AngusAg » November 10th, 2019, 1:28 pm

I could be off, but in watching the replay of the 4th down attempt, it looked like Love wanted to keep the ball. It looked like Love had a clear path to the end zone, but Bright may have forced the issue.by not releasing the ball. IDK, just looked that way to me. :noidea:



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Re: 4th down

Post by sneed » November 10th, 2019, 1:31 pm

SasquatchAggie wrote:I agreed with going for it. The reason we ended up getting a stop right after that is because they had the lead and went conservative.
I agree. Not usually the best to get no points but in this situation it might have helped us to get zero instead of 3. That’s why you go for it but come up with a better play so you get it. 6 or 8 is better than 0.



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Re: 4th down

Post by Jjoey53 » November 10th, 2019, 2:43 pm

Agree with the decision to go, but that was a very bad play call, too predictable.


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Re: 4th down

Post by fivejazzfans » November 10th, 2019, 3:04 pm

The play was predictable and tired, but holy moly Terrell got blown up on that play to allow the 5 yard loss
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Re: 4th down

Post by FloridaAggie13 » November 10th, 2019, 3:07 pm

Blitz79 wrote:
November 10th, 2019, 11:56 am
I disagree. I would have gone for the field goal and the lead. You said it yourself, we couldn't stop them. With 5 minutes left if we get the lead with a field goal, then they go back and score then we get the ball back with a chance to win the game. Sure they could run the time down but at least we are within 1 score.

If we get stopped like we did and they go score a TD(remember we weren't stopping them) it's game over.

Thank goodness we got that 3rd down stop and ended up winning the game. But you take the point and the lead in that situation. It would be fun to have a what would you do in that scenario poll.
With a two point lead all FSU had to do was kick a FG. With the ease at which they were moving the ball they simply would have done what we did - get into FG range and run down the clock and kick the FG on the last play or with very little time left for us to respond.

Scoring a touchdown forces them to score a touchdown while taking away their power to control the clock.



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Re: 4th down

Post by tkmad » November 10th, 2019, 7:35 pm

fivejazzfans wrote:
November 10th, 2019, 3:04 pm
The play was predictable and tired, but holy moly Terrell got blown up on that play to allow the 5 yard loss
He got blown up, but when I watched the play again today, I think he actually flinches before snap and should have been called for a false start. If called, we kick a FG and who knows what happens. Glad it wasn't, it all worked out 😁

At the 20:15 mark of video




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Re: 4th down

Post by bull » November 10th, 2019, 8:12 pm

AngusAg wrote:
November 10th, 2019, 1:28 pm
I could be off, but in watching the replay of the 4th down attempt, it looked like Love wanted to keep the ball. It looked like Love had a clear path to the end zone, but Bright may have forced the issue.by not releasing the ball. IDK, just looked that way to me. :noidea:
I thought the exact same thing watching it live. Their d end crashed down hard on Bright. It looked like Love was trying to pull it.



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Re: 4th down

Post by GUS » November 10th, 2019, 8:35 pm

On the second down of that series, Love should have kept the ball and ran to the corner on his right. He had a clear path and the angle on any defenders. But we ran it up the gut again.



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Re: 4th down

Post by Aglicious » November 10th, 2019, 9:18 pm

aceofspadeskb wrote:
November 10th, 2019, 9:57 am
It baffles me that we refuse to play under center. I keep expecting to see it because it's part of Jordan Love's warm up routine. It's infuriating to start a 4th and inches with a 4 yard snap.

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Agreed. The fact that we don't ever line up under center, even in short yardage, makes me think the staff has made the decision that doing so woukd tip our hand. The problem is that we end up running it up the gut anyway so why not at least give your RB a chance to hit the hole going full speed to get 1 yard instead of having to essentially gain 5 yards after taking a handoff standing still in the backfield?
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Re: 4th down

Post by FloridaAggie13 » November 10th, 2019, 10:17 pm

Aglicious wrote:
November 10th, 2019, 9:18 pm
aceofspadeskb wrote:
November 10th, 2019, 9:57 am
It baffles me that we refuse to play under center. I keep expecting to see it because it's part of Jordan Love's warm up routine. It's infuriating to start a 4th and inches with a 4 yard snap.

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Agreed. The fact that we don't ever line up under center, even in short yardage, makes me think the staff has made the decision that doing so woukd tip our hand. The problem is that we end up running it up the gut anyway so why not at least give your RB a chance to hit the hole going full speed to get 1 yard instead of having to essentially gain 5 yards after taking a handoff standing still in the backfield?
Agreed.

A creative OC would simply line up under center, supposedly tipping his hand, and then run a bootleg.
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Re: 4th down

Post by Aglicious » November 10th, 2019, 10:37 pm

FloridaAggie13 wrote:
November 10th, 2019, 10:17 pm
Aglicious wrote:
November 10th, 2019, 9:18 pm
aceofspadeskb wrote:
November 10th, 2019, 9:57 am
It baffles me that we refuse to play under center. I keep expecting to see it because it's part of Jordan Love's warm up routine. It's infuriating to start a 4th and inches with a 4 yard snap.

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Agreed. The fact that we don't ever line up under center, even in short yardage, makes me think the staff has made the decision that doing so woukd tip our hand. The problem is that we end up running it up the gut anyway so why not at least give your RB a chance to hit the hole going full speed to get 1 yard instead of having to essentially gain 5 yards after taking a handoff standing still in the backfield?
Agreed.

A creative OC would simply line up under center, supposedly tipping his hand, and then run a bootleg.
Ding! Ding! Ding!
Too bad creativity is not something that we have witnessed yet this season. I almost had to laugh at our "trick play" attempt. When a D sees Love lined up under center they have to know something is up. No RPO in play? Hmmm i wonder what that obvious WR staying behind the QB is doing over there? That play was doomed from the beginning because everything about it caused everyone on the field to look directly at it. The best part is that there was nothing except a single TE out on a short route to that side of the field on the play and he had no less than 4 guys within 5 yards of him! Lol...maybe we're setting up the next team for some variation of that play that is actually designed well.
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Re: 4th down

Post by NVAggie » November 11th, 2019, 8:41 am

I agree lockouts. That was a stupid trick play that tricked no one. Sanford has obviously never gambled.



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Re: 4th down

Post by dyedblue » November 11th, 2019, 8:45 am

The trick play was no different than running our RPO crap. There might be one potential recover and the entire defense covering the play.


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Re: 4th down

Post by ChicAggie » November 11th, 2019, 10:47 am

1. We need to run 5-10 play action/handoffs/RPOs from under center every game to keep the option (no pun intended) alive. Absolutely ridiculous to start out of shotgun on a 4th-and-inches.

2. The math says it was 100% the right decision to go for it, but it was 100% the wrong play call.
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Re: 4th down

Post by El Sapo » November 11th, 2019, 11:07 am

That looked like an option where both Love and Bright didn't want the ball. LOL. I can laugh because we won, but cmon man!!!!!

Coaches don't have a short yardage play proven by our WORST IN THE COUNTRY RED ZONE CONVERSION PERCENTAGE!!!!!

Whoever said we needed to get Love under center way back after WF? Have a :cheers: on me!


I can see how these decisions might seem overwhelming for some posters, football is complex. It can seem like a single decision doesn't matter because there are too many variables......That wasn't the case with Wake Forest

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Re: 4th down

Post by Yossarian » November 11th, 2019, 12:14 pm

FloridaAggie13 wrote:
November 10th, 2019, 9:50 am
100% right decision, completely disagree with the play call.

We had only stopped FSU once in the 2nd half at that point so a FG giving us a 2 pt lead was too little of an advantage.

The play call was too predictable. Would rather see misdirection in that situation to take advantage of the D's propensity to be over aggressive on a 4th down all or nothing play at the goal line. BYUs WR screen in a similar situation last week is a good example. A lot more options than a slow developing handoff. How about going under center? Play action? Use pre snap motion to gain half a step or again, cause distraction.

Theatricality and Deception are indeed powerful agents and we could have used some in that situation.

Or, perhaps Sanford isn't a fan of the Dark Knight Trilogy.
Absolutely the right decision. A field goal only puts you up two points. Assuming a touchback on the ensuing kickoff, Fresno only needs to get about 40 or so yards to get in field goal range. There were just over 5 minutes left in the game at that point. A long, time-consuming drive to get into field goal range and the game is, essentially, over for USU. At that point in the game, USU needed the points to force Fresno to drive all the way to the end zone to beat them.

On the play calling - 1st and goal from the 2. The O-line has to have some push to get two yards. That is unacceptable. I wonder if the decision to not go with a play-action roll-out pass type of play was made with the poor decisions and passes by Love in previous games that resulted in interceptions. Love was composed in finding Repp for the 11-yard pass on that final drive, but my gut was reminding me of the final drives against Michigan State and Wake Forest. Big 10-yard run by Bright, that was huge. Last year - this is a simple back corner jump-ball to RonQuavion Tarver for 6.

I'm just glad Fresno didn't get the memo to run jet sweeps and options around the edge against USU. The Aggies have no idea how to defend that.



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Re: 4th down

Post by USU78 » November 11th, 2019, 12:30 pm

The head coach is a former offensive lineman. That being the case, he understands the neurosis that imbues every big guy with a number from 50 to 79. The Ags had done reasonably well during the 4th quarter up to the 1st down run getting the Ags down to the 2. While I agree that the specific play calls were uninspired, the call to run it in was without doubt correct. GA was telling his OL, which had been taking some serious (and well-deserved) flak for its play the last 3 weeks, that he believed in them and was putting the game on their shoulders.

Yes, they couldn't get it done. Yes, the 4th down play didn't see better performances than the prior two plays. And yes, the guys behind them were confused about what ought to happen, especially under the circumstances where the Fresno LB (# 15, I think) came crashing down from offensive right to left, just behind the OL's heels, right towards the intended off guard/off tackle left point of attack. If Bright cuts back against the grain immediately, he probably scores. If Love pulls the ball out and cuts inside the spy, he probably scores. Love made the wrong call to hand off. Bright made the wrong call to attack off tackle left. We all saw the result.

Yet, after the Ags got the ball back a couple of minutes later, the OL stepped it up. GA's confidence in them during the prior series, even though it ended in momentary failure, demonstrated GA was willing to trust them. They got the couple of first downs needed, the clock ran down, and GA's gamble ended up working out.
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You keep using that word. I do not think that word means what you think it means.

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Re: 4th down

Post by Donman » November 11th, 2019, 12:35 pm

There was no blocking on that 4th down play. I'm not certain any play call would have worked. It seemed multiple O Lineman were 2-3 yards in the backfield.



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Re: 4th down

Post by USU78 » November 11th, 2019, 12:42 pm

Donman wrote:
November 11th, 2019, 12:35 pm
There was no blocking on that 4th down play. I'm not certain any play call would have worked. It seemed multiple O Lineman were 2-3 yards in the backfield.
No question Fresno got a good push on that one, but the biggest problem was the crashing LB, whom our TE was unable to get in front of. He's the one who made contact five yards deep with Bright taking off laterally left just as the guy got there, running unencumbered, chased by the TE. The interior guys didn't get a push themselves, but weren't pushed back into the backfield.


You keep using that word. I do not think that word means what you think it means.

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Re: 4th down

Post by Jjoey53 » November 11th, 2019, 1:27 pm

Under center snap?


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Re: 4th down

Post by El Sapo » November 11th, 2019, 3:00 pm

Jjoey53 wrote:
November 11th, 2019, 1:27 pm
Under center snap?


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Huh? What's that? :joking:


I can see how these decisions might seem overwhelming for some posters, football is complex. It can seem like a single decision doesn't matter because there are too many variables......That wasn't the case with Wake Forest

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