13=13

Interesting. Former Aggie recruit/CSI player Matt Glover is on there as well.

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketb ... att-glover

23.5% from the field this season

6 players leaving Utah.

Boise State is losing a couple of solid players

tweet from Thoseby yesterday

Ritte Van Vlaanderen wrote:tweet from Thoseby yesterday

Is that a shoe brand?

I liked thoseby and wanted him to succeed here, but if he thinks the coaches are showing a lack of integrity for counseling him out then he needs a dose of reality. The coaches have as much or more on the line when it comes to success on the court. They lose their job if they don‘t win. Thoseby had every opportunity to earn another year with utah state, and he wasn‘t good enough. I hope he finds a good home.
.

I really liked Thoseby. Wish he could've stayed around.

How in the world does this guy get information to create this list?

hipsterdoofus21 wrote:13=13

Is this the correct list of the 13 as it currently stands?

1. Reed
2. Bruneel
3. Medlin
4. Shaw
5. Lopez
6. Bair
7. Harris
8. Davis
9. Conner/Roland
10. Butterfield
11. Stone
12. Clifford
13. Bradshaw
EJ - walk-on

Where does Marvin Jean play into this equation? If he comes does Bruneel get shown the door or would Butterfield be on a non-athletic scholarship? Is Harris still in tow?

utaggies wrote:

hipsterdoofus21 wrote:13=13

Is this the correct list of the 13 as it currently stands?

1. Reed
2. Bruneel
3. Medlin
4. Shaw
5. Lopez
6. Bair
7. Harris
8. Davis
9. Conner/Roland
10. Butterfield
11. Stone
12. Clifford
13. Bradshaw
EJ - walk-on

Where does Marvin Jean play into this equation? If he comes does Bruneel get shown the door or would Butterfield be on a non-athletic scholarship? Is Harris still in tow?

Berger?

With regard to the scholarship counting, it might be interesting to mention that Morgan Grim was on athletic scholarship the past two years. Try and explain that one. I'm willing to let Stew figure out the scholly situation. He always does.

Here's an update to the yearly rosters that I keep in the recruits thread (that is embarrassingly out of date).

I'm not 100% positive, but I believe Clifford is on a non-athletic scholarship and not one of the 13

hipsterdoofus21 wrote:I liked thoseby and wanted him to succeed here, but if he thinks the coaches are showing a lack of integrity for counseling him out then he needs a dose of reality. The coaches have as much or more on the line when it comes to success on the court. They lose their job if they don‘t win. Thoseby had every opportunity to earn another year with utah state, and he wasn‘t good enough. I hope he finds a good home.
.

Just because coaches have a lot on the line doesn't mean they don't make mistakes. Look at Jeremy Lin for example. He is just the latest example not the exception by the way. I'm not saying Thoseby is right, but we don't know the behind the scenes story either. In his defense, I can see where he believes he should have received more playing time over Bruneel as he didn't overly impress. It's all about opportunity. Maybe he had his. Maybe he didn't. I'll most likely will never know.

Oh i agree they make mistakes and in this case thoseby wasn‘t the right choice, my point was if these coaches want to keep their job they need to make these tough adjustments. Scholarships are awarded on a yearly basis and based on performance and potential, thats what it boils down to.

It's a harsh reality, but basketball scholarships are similar to regular academic scholarships. I was on scholarship at the business college while I was at Utah State, but I had to re-apply every year and there was no guarantee that I would be awarded the scholarship again. It was performance based.

That said, I feel bad for Thoseby. He seemed to do everything that was asked of him, and seems to be a great guy. I wish him only the best.

Seldomseensmith wrote:I think Thoseby has the talent, but not the confidence, to play at this level. It seemed like he was shocked by the speed and competitiveness of D1 ball, and panicked somewhat when faced with any pressure at all. Maybe he could overcome that with time, but he couldn't this year.

I agree with that assessment. I hope he finds a good situation from here on out where he can really shine.

Also interesting to see good ol' Shamburger on there for SJSU. He is headed to Hawaii correct?

utaggies wrote:

hipsterdoofus21 wrote:13=13

Is this the correct list of the 13 as it currently stands?

1. Reed
2. Bruneel
3. Medlin
4. Shaw
5. Lopez
6. Bair
7. Harris
8. Davis
9. Conner/Roland
10. Butterfield
11. Stone
12. Clifford
13. Bradshaw
EJ - walk-on

Where does Marvin Jean play into this equation? If he comes does Bruneel get shown the door or would Butterfield be on a non-athletic scholarship? Is Harris still in tow?

That list has a couple of problems -- let me try.
1. Reed - agreed
2. Clifford - agreed
3. Stone - agreed
4. Shaw - agreed
5. Lopez - agreed
6. Medlin - agreed
7. Bradshaw - agreed
8. Bair - agreed
9. Davis - agreed
10. Butterfield - agreed
Now for the interesting ones:
11. Berger - not on your list, but I think he stays
12. Connor/Roland - on your list and I think we take one of them.
13. SF - Do we keep Bruneel or take Marvin Jean (or in my dreams Hammork)
Extra - What about Harris - he doesn't have a year to sit out; will he walkon, etc.

I don't think Thoseby and Igor are the last 2 to be "counseled out", and yes our spring recruiting has sucked the last few years.

Aglicious wrote:Also interesting to see good ol' Shamburger on there for SJSU. He is headed to Hawaii correct?

That's what I read on the WAC board.

hipsterdoofus21 wrote:Oh i agree they make mistakes and in this case thoseby wasn‘t the right choice, my point was if these coaches want to keep their job they need to make these tough adjustments. Scholarships are awarded on a yearly basis and based on performance and potential, thats what it boils down to.

My point Hipster has always been, why sign such marginal players. There was nothing about Igor's or Thoseby's previous accolades that would indicate they had any chance of performing at this level. In almost 99.99% of the cases, If a kid can't excell at a lower level, he's not going to excell at a much higher level. Taking 2 or 3 chances every year in spring recruiting is a waste and creates a situation where "Integrity" is called into question as Thoseby just did. By the way, there is no way that both Bruneel and Berger can stay if we sign Jean or another SF. Harris is also a big question mark at this time.

USUBlue wrote:
I don't think Thoseby and Igor are the last 2 to be "counseled out", and yes our spring recruiting has sucked the last few years.

How do you think this Spring has been? any better? I only ask because I find it curious that we find ourselves fighting for recruits that have their only other offers from the likes of Coppin St., Norfolk St., and Morehead St. Is this the talent level we need or should we be setting our sights a little higher?

In the spring, are you saying 11=13. Not sign anyone?

WAAggie wrote:In the spring, are you saying 11=13. Not sign anyone?

Or, let a senior walkon like Grimm have an athletic scholarship for 1 year. Igor and Thoseby weren't even stars at their respective JC and Prep school levels -- now according to Thoseby, we lack integrity. OR --- let's recruit highly successful players at their previous lower levels.

Butterfield should be a good recruit -- a little undersized, but we'll see. What I don't understand is why we aren't recruiting potential NBA players like Fresno, Nevada, NMST, etc. Why can't we get a Hammork to come to USU?

Aglicious wrote:

USUBlue wrote:
I don't think Thoseby and Igor are the last 2 to be "counseled out", and yes our spring recruiting has sucked the last few years.

How do you think this Spring has been? any better? I only ask because I find it curious that we find ourselves fighting for recruits that have their only other offers from the likes of Coppin St., Norfolk St., and Morehead St. Is this the talent level we need or should we be setting our sights a little higher?

Butterfield had offers from:

* Hawaii (Offered)
* Pacific (Offered)
* San Jose State (Offered)
* UC Riverside (Offered)
* Utah (Offered)

With other PAC12 schools showing interest.

I'm also not sure who offers a player is a good indicator of how successful he will be at Utah State. Who offered Tai Wesley, Jaycee Carroll, Preston Medlin, Jared Quayle, and Gary Wilkinson just to name a few All WAC first teamers...

USUBlue wrote:

WAAggie wrote:In the spring, are you saying 11=13. Not sign anyone?

Or, let a senior walkon like Grimm have an athletic scholarship for 1 year.

Grim was on athletic scholarship the past 2 years.

Someone pointed out that even academic scholarships are re-newed each year. I think what makes not renewing a bball scholarhip so difficult is the lack of objective criteria. If I am on an academic, i know I have to maintain a 3.5 GPA or I will lose it. On a bball scholarship I could play my best, improve, but just not pan out to be the player that the coachers though I was. That makes it hard to accept. Because the coach mis-evaluated the player's talent the player is punished despite meeting the criteria they felt was necessary to maintain the scholarship.

That being said, it is my understanding that when a player doesn't have their scholarship renewed and is asked to leave the team, they STILL HAVE TO WAIT A YEAR TO PLAY IF THEY TRANSFER. If that is accurate, the NCAA is a complete joke. "Student"-athletes are used and abused.

tkmad wrote:I think what makes not renewing a bball scholarhip so difficult is the lack of objective criteria. If I am on an academic, i know I have to maintain a 3.5 GPA or I will lose it.

That may be true for some types of academic scholarships, but it is not true for all of them. The college of business scholarships that I had while in school came from a pool of scholarships that were awarded new each year based on a number of criteria. There was no way to "keep" the scholarship you had by simply achieving a certain objective criteria. If you wished to get a scholarship for the coming year you had to re-apply, write an essay on why you felt you were deserving, and hope for the best. Yes, GPA definitely played a large factor in most of the scholarship awards, but not all of them. In fact, I know for a fact that there are scholarships at Utah State that are specifically geared towards students with moderate-level GPAs (higher GPAs are excluded). Others are just subjectively chosen by the donor.

tkmad wrote:\
That being said, it is my understanding that when a player doesn't have their scholarship renewed and is asked to leave the team, they STILL HAVE TO WAIT A YEAR TO PLAY IF THEY TRANSFER. If that is accurate, the NCAA is a complete joke. "Student"-athletes are used and abused.

I agree that the transfer rule doesn't make much sense in these instances.

It's also important to realize that this is a two way street. There are plenty of examples where the player is the one leaving the coaching staff high and dry. James Walker, Antonio Bumpus, Steven Thornton....Players who commit and renege. It goes both ways.

I had one in the college of business as well for my first 2 years. It was pretty straight forward, laid out the criteria to keep it. I did receive one after that for years 3-4 that was more of a random selection by a donor, but once the scholarship was awarded, the criteria to keep it was straight forward. I can see the type you described as being less clear when awarded on an annual basis. Still a joke that they can't transfer and play somewhere else though. Losing my academic scholarship at USU doesn't inhibit me from going to Weber the following year if they were to award me one.

tkmad wrote:I had one in the college of business as well for my first 2 years. It was pretty straight forward, laid out the criteria to keep it. I did receive one after that for years 3-4 that was more of a random selection by a donor, but once the scholarship was awarded, the criteria to keep it was straight forward. I can see the type you described as being less clear when awarded on an annual basis. Still a joke that they can't transfer and play somewhere else though. Losing my academic scholarship at USU doesn't inhibit me from going to Weber the following year if they were to award me one.

I agree 100%.