If Seattle would have learned from our board years ago, just give the ball to #22 and everything would have been alright.

Coloraggie wrote:If Seattle would have learned from our board years ago, just give the ball to #22 and everything would have been alright.

I remember an overtime game in Romney against CSU that says otherwise.

AgMac wrote:

Coloraggie wrote:If Seattle would have learned from our board years ago, just give the ball to #22 and everything would have been alright.

I remember an overtime game in Romney against CSU that says otherwise.

That must be the rule and not the exception

Give it to any back in the situation they were in. Lynch is better than Turbin in almost every scenario IMO.

AgMac wrote:

Coloraggie wrote:If Seattle would have learned from our board years ago, just give the ball to #22 and everything would have been alright.

I remember an overtime game in Romney against CSU that says otherwise.

Unless you run Turbin to the outside, then yes. Fortunately, Baldwin learned from his mistake and, a few weeks later, ran Turbin straight up the gut in the waning moments vs Hawaii. Everyone at Aloha Stadium knew where that ball was going to go on that play. There was no 'disguise' in the formation, no trickery, and no decoy. We had all the receivers out, TE's in... single set back, power formation, with Kennedy under center. Everyone knew, before the snap, that Turbin was going to get the ball, and that this time, he was not going to be denied the endzone.

Likewise, I don't think Lynch was going to be denied at that moment. The best power runner in the game, I think he could've taken on anyone on the New England defense, and I still think Lynch was not going to be denied the endzone. He was destined for it. He had been doing it all night long. Getting hit at the point of contact and then moving the pile ahead a few more yards(did anyone else notice how vicious Lynch's hits were, especially as that game wore on??). He did it all NIGHT!! Why he doesn't get that touch on 2nd down, especially when you have a timeout to burn, is stupefyingly absurd.

I can kind of get the call. With only 31 seconds on the clock and one time out left, you get three tries instead of two if the pass falls incomplete. You pass on second, if that falls incomplete, you run on third. If you don't get in on third down, you use the time out and re-group for the fourth down play.

If you run on second and don't get in, yo have to use the time out. Then you only get one more chance because the clock will most likely have expired before you can set up and run a fourth down play.

The bad call was not throwing a corner fade as opposed to a quick slant. I don''t mind the pass play, it was just the wrong type of pass play.

Roll out with Luke WIlson to either block or catch a pass. If covered, throw the ball away or go out of bounds. It will be 2nd guessed for eternity.

Yossarian wrote:I can kind of get the call. With only 31 seconds on the clock and one time out left, you get three tries instead of two if the pass falls incomplete. You pass on second, if that falls incomplete, you run on third. If you don't get in on third down, you use the time out and re-group for the fourth down play.

If you run on second and don't get in, yo have to use the time out. Then you only get one more chance because the clock will most likely have expired before you can set up and run a fourth down play.

The bad call was not throwing a corner fade as opposed to a quick slant. I don''t mind the pass play, it was just the wrong type of pass play.

Unless you throw on 3rd down. You let Lynch have a shot at it on 2nd down. If he doesn't, burn the TO, you should have about 15 seconds left. Pass on 3rd. If that is incomplete, you set up for 4th down, run or pass, for all the marbles.

AGGZILLA wrote:

AgMac wrote:

Coloraggie wrote:If Seattle would have learned from our board years ago, just give the ball to #22 and everything would have been alright.

Fortunately, Baldwin learned from his mistake and, a few weeks later, ran Turbin straight up the gut in the waning moments vs Hawaii. Everyone at Aloha Stadium knew where that ball was going to go on that play. There was no 'disguise' in the formation, no trickery, and no decoy. We had all the receivers out, TE's in... single set back, power formation, with Kennedy under center. Everyone knew, before the snap, that Turbin was going to get the ball, and that this time, he was not going to be denied the endzone.

Tarren told me that in the huddle before this play he looked Turbin in the eye and said dude just follow me I dont care what you hear or see just follow me up the hole! Then when he did Tarren picked Turbin up and was yelling I told I told you! This gives me goose bumps every time I think about it!

Yossarian wrote:I can kind of get the call. With only 31 seconds on the clock and one time out left, you get three tries instead of two if the pass falls incomplete. You pass on second, if that falls incomplete, you run on third. If you don't get in on third down, you use the time out and re-group for the fourth down play.

If you run on second and don't get in, yo have to use the time out. Then you only get one more chance because the clock will most likely have expired before you can set up and run a fourth down play.

The bad call was not throwing a corner fade as opposed to a quick slant. I don''t mind the pass play, it was just the wrong type of pass play.

Exactly. I'm no Pete Carroll apologist. He is one of my least favorite people. But he is taking a lot of undue criticism for the play call, IMO. Yossarian's analysis is spot on. While Lynch probably scores given several chances, he may not necessarily score on that 2nd down. I agree that he is an absolute freak of nature that can drag a pile of 300 pound men several yards down the field. However, there were a few plays, and only a few, when he was stuffed at the line of scrimmage, or even a slight loss. Pats had their goal line defense in. Try a pass on 2nd. If it doesn't work, run Lynch on 3rd. If he doesn't get it, use your last timeout and decide what you want to do on 4th - probably run Lynch again. It wasn't the worse call ever.

The biggest blunder was clock management. Carroll, like me, probably thought the Pats were going to use a timeout after 1st down (that got to the 1 yard line) to try and preserve some clock for a last minute drive after a Seattle score (which seemed like a foregoing conclusion). But Belichick didn't use one. Seattle stumbled around indecisively and let a ton of time tick off. The result? They felt like the had to pass it to stop the clock (and preserve their last time out for after 3rd down). Seattle should have quickly gotten back to the line after first down, called Lynch's number up the middle, and ran it. If it wasn't successful, you've still got plenty of time to huddle up and call another play. If that doesn't work, you've still got your timeout to come up with the perfect 4th down play.

All that said, glad they lost. Go Pats!!!

Yossarian wrote:I can kind of get the call. With only 31 seconds on the clock and one time out left, you get three tries instead of two if the pass falls incomplete. You pass on second, if that falls incomplete, you run on third. If you don't get in on third down, you use the time out and re-group for the fourth down play.

If you run on second and don't get in, yo have to use the time out. Then you only get one more chance because the clock will most likely have expired before you can set up and run a fourth down play.

The bad call was not throwing a corner fade as opposed to a quick slant. I don''t mind the pass play, it was just the wrong type of pass play.

This please, Yossarian is reasoning us through the rewind. Check out the reply and you will see 8 Patriot defenders in the box... Seattle knew where they wanted to go, and against an undrafted rookie to boot. Likely the next 99 identical plays don't get picked. Just life happening in the spotlight of sports, and this was a huge stage for the event.

Well, I dont "kind of get the call", at all! With less than a yard to go, YOU GO FOR THE SURE THING....Marshawn Lynch! At least at the time, it was the closest thing to a sure thing. And you had the luxury to try it twice. If Lynch and the OLine can't get a yard in two tries...they don't deserve to win.

I disagree. It was THE WORST play call in the HISTORY of the NFL.

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Passing the ball could almost be permissible, but dropping back five years and attempting to run a slant pass to the one yard line into ten patriot defenders makes it the worst call imaginable.

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treesap32 wrote:Passing the ball could almost be permissible, but dropping back five years and attempting to run a slant pass to the one yard line into ten patriot defenders makes it the worst call imaginable.

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Yup. That sums it up perfectly.

Bootleg that thing all day. They couldn't touch Wilson in the open field and it gives the kid options. Instead, they play the goat.

It is worth noting that on the season Lynch was 1 for 5 scoring from the one yard line.

AgMac wrote:It is worth noting that on the season Lynch was 1 for 5 scoring from the one yard line.

It's also worth noting that the Patriots defense had given up TD runs from the 1-yard line 5 out of 5 times this season.

AGGZILLA wrote:

AgMac wrote:It is worth noting that on the season Lynch was 1 for 5 scoring from the one yard line.

It's also worth noting that the Patriots defense had given up TD runs from the 1-yard line 5 out of 5 times this season.

Good point. It really isn't too hard. Lynch is probably well below average in the NFL.

I was just joking on my previous post, but I looked it up anyway. First, your stat is wrong. The patriots actually allowed 5 of 6 . Still a lot worse than the league average of 54 percent, which Lynch was well under at 20 percent. In fact, during the last 5 seasons, among 39 running backs averaging at least 10 carries per season, Lynch ranks 30th scoring from the 1 yard line.

AgMac wrote:It is worth noting that on the season Lynch was 1 for 5 scoring from the one yard line.

It's also worth noting that the Patriots intercepted the pass and won the game because of the play call. You don't throw the ball on a timing route into coverage that has at least 8 defenders in a 5 yard by 15 yard area.

dyedblue wrote:

AgMac wrote:It is worth noting that on the season Lynch was 1 for 5 scoring from the one yard line.

It's also worth noting that the Patriots intercepted the pass and won the game because of the play call. You don't throw the ball on a timing route into coverage that has at least 8 defenders in a 5 yard by 15 yard area.

Interestingly, out of 109 passes from the 1 yard line this season in the NFL, that was the first pick. In other words, it is generally a low risk call. Out of those 109 passes, 61% resulted in touchdowns - 7 % higher than run plays from the 1.

AgMac wrote:

dyedblue wrote:

AgMac wrote:It is worth noting that on the season Lynch was 1 for 5 scoring from the one yard line.

It's also worth noting that the Patriots intercepted the pass and won the game because of the play call. You don't throw the ball on a timing route into coverage that has at least 8 defenders in a 5 yard by 15 yard area.

Interestingly, out of 109 passes from the 1 yard line this season in the NFL, that was the first pick. In other words, it is generally a low risk call. Out of those 109 passes, 61% resulted in touchdowns - 7 % higher than run plays from the 1.

How many of those were crossing routes in the back of the endzone or fades? Those are low risk passes. A 1 yard slant into the stacked box is not a low risk pass.

AgMac wrote:

dyedblue wrote:

AgMac wrote:It is worth noting that on the season Lynch was 1 for 5 scoring from the one yard line.

It's also worth noting that the Patriots intercepted the pass and won the game because of the play call. You don't throw the ball on a timing route into coverage that has at least 8 defenders in a 5 yard by 15 yard area.

Interestingly, out of 109 passes from the 1 yard line this season in the NFL, that was the first pick. In other words, it is generally a low risk call. Out of those 109 passes, 61% resulted in touchdowns - 7 % higher than run plays from the 1.

How many of those 109 passes were 5-yard drop back slant passes to the 1 yard line in the middle of the field where they stacked everyone in the box?

3rdGenAggie wrote:

AgMac wrote:

dyedblue wrote:

AgMac wrote:It is worth noting that on the season Lynch was 1 for 5 scoring from the one yard line.

It's also worth noting that the Patriots intercepted the pass and won the game because of the play call. You don't throw the ball on a timing route into coverage that has at least 8 defenders in a 5 yard by 15 yard area.

Interestingly, out of 109 passes from the 1 yard line this season in the NFL, that was the first pick. In other words, it is generally a low risk call. Out of those 109 passes, 61% resulted in touchdowns - 7 % higher than run plays from the 1.

How many of those were crossing routes in the back of the endzone or fades? Those are low risk passes. A 1 yard slant into the stacked box is not a low risk pass.

I have no idea, but the topic of this thread was that it should have been a running play to Lynch. I'm just pointing out that stats suggest otherwise.

I am not convinced running was the only option. It was a better option given the situation. My issue is the same as many on here have, throwing into a stacked box from the one yard line. Throw a fade, a bootleg drag route to a TE, or even a play action. I like my chances with Lynch and if not then roll Wilson out where he is in space and can run it in, hit someone in the end zone, or throw it into the 25th row. The odds of that pass being caught were decent but there is a pretty good chance that pass gets deflected up and picked off.