MW expansion plan

Aggie formerly in Hawaii · Post by **Aggie formerly in Hawaii** » August 3rd, 2023, 8:20 pm

utaggies wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 7:00 pm

Slim80 wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 6:09 pm

Aggie formerly in Hawaii wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 5:51 pm

utaggies wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 3:48 pm

OrangeCountyAggie wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 3:39 pm

Imakeitrain wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 12:43 pm
If the acc implodes i think that takes a lot of exit opportunities from PAC schools and will eventually mean that SDSU, Boise and maybe 2 other MWC schools leave. Given the ACC development I can see the following conference changes- aside from already confirmed-

To SEC: Florida State, Clemson

To Big 12: Arizona, Arizona State, Pitt, Syracuse, Miami

To Big 10: Virginia Tech, UVA, UNC, Oregon, Washington, Stanford

To ACC: Memphis, USF and other AAC teams

To PAC 12: Boise, SDSU, UNLV, Fresno, CSU, and one of afa or Wyoming

AAC left overs and MWC leftovers merge
Boise will NEVER be a member of the Pac12.
Yeah — just like BYU would never become a member of the Big 12 because of its religious beliefs and no play on Sunday. The PAC remnants — if they go to 4 or 2 — would welcome BSU into the conference as well as zUNLV and Fresno. The days of the PAC being exclusionary because of academics is over. They are in survival mode right now.
On this we agree. If the Pac 12 dies as we suspect it will and it goes down to 4 teams; Wazzu, OSU, Stanford and Cal; they'll do whatever they can to survive. They'll beg beg beg Boise State to join.
I think you are underestimating the pride of Stanford and Cal when it comes to the importance of academics. I don't think either of those schools will be caught dead with Boise in their ranks. Those two schools are arguably the most academically premier universities on the west coast.
And right now their reputations and a $1 will buy you a cup of coffee at a Big 10 or Big 12 deli.

Yeah they'll be very lucky to save their league. They'll be begging the premier MW teams to join.

Slim80 · Post by **Slim80** » August 3rd, 2023, 9:22 pm

Aggie formerly in Hawaii wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 8:20 pm

utaggies wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 7:00 pm

Slim80 wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 6:09 pm

Aggie formerly in Hawaii wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 5:51 pm

utaggies wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 3:48 pm

OrangeCountyAggie wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 3:39 pm

Imakeitrain wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 12:43 pm
If the acc implodes i think that takes a lot of exit opportunities from PAC schools and will eventually mean that SDSU, Boise and maybe 2 other MWC schools leave. Given the ACC development I can see the following conference changes- aside from already confirmed-

To SEC: Florida State, Clemson

To Big 12: Arizona, Arizona State, Pitt, Syracuse, Miami

To Big 10: Virginia Tech, UVA, UNC, Oregon, Washington, Stanford

To ACC: Memphis, USF and other AAC teams

To PAC 12: Boise, SDSU, UNLV, Fresno, CSU, and one of afa or Wyoming

AAC left overs and MWC leftovers merge
Boise will NEVER be a member of the Pac12.
Yeah — just like BYU would never become a member of the Big 12 because of its religious beliefs and no play on Sunday. The PAC remnants — if they go to 4 or 2 — would welcome BSU into the conference as well as zUNLV and Fresno. The days of the PAC being exclusionary because of academics is over. They are in survival mode right now.
On this we agree. If the Pac 12 dies as we suspect it will and it goes down to 4 teams; Wazzu, OSU, Stanford and Cal; they'll do whatever they can to survive. They'll beg beg beg Boise State to join.
I think you are underestimating the pride of Stanford and Cal when it comes to the importance of academics. I don't think either of those schools will be caught dead with Boise in their ranks. Those two schools are arguably the most academically premier universities on the west coast.
And right now their reputations and a $1 will buy you a cup of coffee at a Big 10 or Big 12 deli.
Yeah they'll be very lucky to save their league. They'll be begging the premier MW teams to join.

I agree they are screwed. I just think Stanford will go the Indy route before they stay in a conference consisting of MWC schools.

NowhereLandAggie · Post by **NowhereLandAggie** » August 3rd, 2023, 9:57 pm

Slim80 wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 9:22 pm

Aggie formerly in Hawaii wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 8:20 pm

utaggies wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 7:00 pm

Slim80 wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 6:09 pm

Aggie formerly in Hawaii wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 5:51 pm

utaggies wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 3:48 pm

OrangeCountyAggie wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 3:39 pm

Imakeitrain wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 12:43 pm
If the acc implodes i think that takes a lot of exit opportunities from PAC schools and will eventually mean that SDSU, Boise and maybe 2 other MWC schools leave. Given the ACC development I can see the following conference changes- aside from already confirmed-

To SEC: Florida State, Clemson

To Big 12: Arizona, Arizona State, Pitt, Syracuse, Miami

To Big 10: Virginia Tech, UVA, UNC, Oregon, Washington, Stanford

To ACC: Memphis, USF and other AAC teams

To PAC 12: Boise, SDSU, UNLV, Fresno, CSU, and one of afa or Wyoming

AAC left overs and MWC leftovers merge
Boise will NEVER be a member of the Pac12.
Yeah — just like BYU would never become a member of the Big 12 because of its religious beliefs and no play on Sunday. The PAC remnants — if they go to 4 or 2 — would welcome BSU into the conference as well as zUNLV and Fresno. The days of the PAC being exclusionary because of academics is over. They are in survival mode right now.
On this we agree. If the Pac 12 dies as we suspect it will and it goes down to 4 teams; Wazzu, OSU, Stanford and Cal; they'll do whatever they can to survive. They'll beg beg beg Boise State to join.
I think you are underestimating the pride of Stanford and Cal when it comes to the importance of academics. I don't think either of those schools will be caught dead with Boise in their ranks. Those two schools are arguably the most academically premier universities on the west coast.
And right now their reputations and a $1 will buy you a cup of coffee at a Big 10 or Big 12 deli.
Yeah they'll be very lucky to save their league. They'll be begging the premier MW teams to join.
I agree they are screwed. I just think Stanford will go the Indy route before they stay in a conference consisting of MWC schools.

I agree Stanford will want to pull that off, but unless they get a scheduling agreement for basketball and Olympic sports with the WCC or Big West, it probably won't happen. I guess we shall see.

swordsman1989 · Post by **swordsman1989** » August 3rd, 2023, 11:37 pm

NowhereLandAggie wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 9:57 pm

I agree Stanford will want to pull that off, but unless they get a scheduling agreement for basketball and Olympic sports with the WCC or Big West, it probably won't happen. I guess we shall see.

Would the MWC accept Stanford as a non-football member?

Football Members:
Air Force
Boise State
Cal
Colorado State
Fresno State
Hawaii
Nevada
New Mexico
Oregon State
San Diego State
San Jose State
UNLV
Utah State
Washington State
Wyoming
+ 1 More (SMU, UTEP, NMSU, anyone...)

BB/Olympic Sports Members:
Air Force
Boise State
Cal
Colorado State
Fresno State
Nevada
New Mexico
Oregon State
San Diego State
San Jose State
Stanford
UNLV
Utah State
Washington State
Wyoming
+1 More (SMU, UTEP, NMSU, anyone...)

NowhereLandAggie · Post by **NowhereLandAggie** » August 4th, 2023, 12:10 am

swordsman1989 wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 11:37 pm

NowhereLandAggie wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 9:57 pm

I agree Stanford will want to pull that off, but unless they get a scheduling agreement for basketball and Olympic sports with the WCC or Big West, it probably won't happen. I guess we shall see.
Would the MWC accept Stanford as a non-football member?

Football Members:
Air Force
Boise State
Cal
Colorado State
Fresno State
Hawaii
Nevada
New Mexico
Oregon State
San Diego State
San Jose State
UNLV
Utah State
Washington State
Wyoming
+ 1 More (SMU, UTEP, NMSU, anyone...)

BB/Olympic Sports Members:
Air Force
Boise State
Cal
Colorado State
Fresno State
Nevada
New Mexico
Oregon State
San Diego State
San Jose State
Stanford
UNLV
Utah State
Washington State
Wyoming
+1 More (SMU, UTEP, NMSU, anyone...)

Do they have that much value? They aren't Notre Dame, and that is a sincere question.

swordsman1989 · Post by **swordsman1989** » August 4th, 2023, 5:54 am

NowhereLandAggie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 12:10 am
[quote=swordsman1989 post_id=887779 time=<a href="tel:1691127435">1691127435</a> user_id=789]
[quote=NowhereLandAggie post_id=887765 time=<a href="tel:1691121420">1691121420</a> user_id=383]

I agree Stanford will want to pull that off, but unless they get a scheduling agreement for basketball and Olympic sports with the WCC or Big West, it probably won't happen. I guess we shall see.

Would the MWC accept Stanford as a non-football member?

Football Members:
Air Force
Boise State
Cal
Colorado State
Fresno State
Hawaii
Nevada
New Mexico
Oregon State
San Diego State
San Jose State
UNLV
Utah State
Washington State
Wyoming
+ 1 More (SMU, UTEP, NMSU, anyone...)

BB/Olympic Sports Members:
Air Force
Boise State
Cal
Colorado State
Fresno State
Nevada
New Mexico
Oregon State
San Diego State
San Jose State
Stanford
UNLV
Utah State
Washington State
Wyoming
+1 More (SMU, UTEP, NMSU, anyone...)
[/quote]

Do they have that much value? They aren't Notre Dame, and that is a sincere question.
[/quote]

No, they definitely are not Notre Dame. But they most assuredly have more value than any current MWC school, or any other school that would conceivably be on the MWC radar.

NowhereLandAggie · Post by **NowhereLandAggie** » August 4th, 2023, 6:22 am

swordsman1989 wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 5:54 am

NowhereLandAggie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 12:10 am
[quote=swordsman1989 post_id=887779 time=<a href="tel:1691127435">1691127435</a> user_id=789]
[quote=NowhereLandAggie post_id=887765 time=<a href="tel:1691121420">1691121420</a> user_id=383]

I agree Stanford will want to pull that off, but unless they get a scheduling agreement for basketball and Olympic sports with the WCC or Big West, it probably won't happen. I guess we shall see.
Would the MWC accept Stanford as a non-football member?

Football Members:
Air Force
Boise State
Cal
Colorado State
Fresno State
Hawaii
Nevada
New Mexico
Oregon State
San Diego State
San Jose State
UNLV
Utah State
Washington State
Wyoming
+ 1 More (SMU, UTEP, NMSU, anyone...)

BB/Olympic Sports Members:
Air Force
Boise State
Cal
Colorado State
Fresno State
Nevada
New Mexico
Oregon State
San Diego State
San Jose State
Stanford
UNLV
Utah State
Washington State
Wyoming
+1 More (SMU, UTEP, NMSU, anyone...)

Do they have that much value? They aren't Notre Dame, and that is a sincere question.
[/quote]

No, they definitely are not Notre Dame. But they most assuredly have more value than any current MWC school, or any other school that would conceivably be on the MWC radar.
[/quote]

I don't mean any dispargement to the Cardinal, in another thread I expressed bewilderment over a team with such a strong all around athletic program being left behind.

However, this is being driven by football and Stanford averages about 35,000 for their home games. They reduced the capacity of the stadium because of those woes. I am not sure whatever iteration of the Western football league comes will allow Stanford without FB only.

travelingagg · Post by **travelingagg** » August 4th, 2023, 6:28 am

NowhereLandAggie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 6:22 am

swordsman1989 wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 5:54 am

NowhereLandAggie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 12:10 am
[quote=swordsman1989 post_id=887779 time=<a href="tel:1691127435">1691127435</a> user_id=789]
[quote=NowhereLandAggie post_id=887765 time=<a href="tel:1691121420">1691121420</a> user_id=383]

I agree Stanford will want to pull that off, but unless they get a scheduling agreement for basketball and Olympic sports with the WCC or Big West, it probably won't happen. I guess we shall see.
Would the MWC accept Stanford as a non-football member?

Football Members:
Air Force
Boise State
Cal
Colorado State
Fresno State
Hawaii
Nevada
New Mexico
Oregon State
San Diego State
San Jose State
UNLV
Utah State
Washington State
Wyoming
+ 1 More (SMU, UTEP, NMSU, anyone...)

BB/Olympic Sports Members:
Air Force
Boise State
Cal
Colorado State
Fresno State
Nevada
New Mexico
Oregon State
San Diego State
San Jose State
Stanford
UNLV
Utah State
Washington State
Wyoming
+1 More (SMU, UTEP, NMSU, anyone...)
Do they have that much value? They aren't Notre Dame, and that is a sincere question.

No, they definitely are not Notre Dame. But they most assuredly have more value than any current MWC school, or any other school that would conceivably be on the MWC radar.
[/quote]

I don't mean any dispargement to the Cardinal, in another thread I expressed bewilderment over a team with such a strong all around athletic program being left behind.

However, this is being driven by football and Stanford averages about 35,000 for their home games. They reduced the capacity of the stadium because of those woes. I am not sure whatever iteration of the Western football league comes will allow Stanford without FB only.
[/quote]

Do we add value? Our average is a lot less than that. Not sure if any MWC school averages more than 35,000.

dogie · Post by **dogie** » August 4th, 2023, 7:27 am

travelingagg wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 6:28 am

NowhereLandAggie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 6:22 am

swordsman1989 wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 5:54 am

NowhereLandAggie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 12:10 am
[quote=swordsman1989 post_id=887779 time=<a href="tel:1691127435">1691127435</a> user_id=789]
[quote=NowhereLandAggie post_id=887765 time=<a href="tel:1691121420">1691121420</a> user_id=383]

I agree Stanford will want to pull that off, but unless they get a scheduling agreement for basketball and Olympic sports with the WCC or Big West, it probably won't happen. I guess we shall see.
Would the MWC accept Stanford as a non-football member?

Football Members:
Air Force
Boise State
Cal
Colorado State
Fresno State
Hawaii
Nevada
New Mexico
Oregon State
San Diego State
San Jose State
UNLV
Utah State
Washington State
Wyoming
+ 1 More (SMU, UTEP, NMSU, anyone...)

BB/Olympic Sports Members:
Air Force
Boise State
Cal
Colorado State
Fresno State
Nevada
New Mexico
Oregon State
San Diego State
San Jose State
Stanford
UNLV
Utah State
Washington State
Wyoming
+1 More (SMU, UTEP, NMSU, anyone...)

Do they have that much value? They aren't Notre Dame, and that is a sincere question.
No, they definitely are not Notre Dame. But they most assuredly have more value than any current MWC school, or any other school that would conceivably be on the MWC radar.
I don't mean any dispargement to the Cardinal, in another thread I expressed bewilderment over a team with such a strong all around athletic program being left behind.

However, this is being driven by football and Stanford averages about 35,000 for their home games. They reduced the capacity of the stadium because of those woes. I am not sure whatever iteration of the Western football league comes will allow Stanford without FB only.

Do we add value? Our average is a lot less than that. Not sure if any MWC school averages more than 35,000.

Stanford has won more NCAA team championships than any other school in the country. They have 134 national championships in 20 sports. Plus they are a top 5 university globally. So, they bring plenty of value.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanfor ... mpionships

Madmartigan · Post by **Madmartigan** » August 4th, 2023, 7:29 am

Where is @StanfordAggie to interject on all things Stanford when you need him?

NowhereLandAggie · Post by **NowhereLandAggie** » August 4th, 2023, 8:56 am

dogie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 7:27 am

travelingagg wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 6:28 am

NowhereLandAggie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 6:22 am

swordsman1989 wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 5:54 am

NowhereLandAggie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 12:10 am
[quote=swordsman1989 post_id=887779 time=<a href="tel:1691127435">1691127435</a> user_id=789]
[quote=NowhereLandAggie post_id=887765 time=<a href="tel:1691121420">1691121420</a> user_id=383]

I agree Stanford will want to pull that off, but unless they get a scheduling agreement for basketball and Olympic sports with the WCC or Big West, it probably won't happen. I guess we shall see.
Would the MWC accept Stanford as a non-football member?

Football Members:
Air Force
Boise State
Cal
Colorado State
Fresno State
Hawaii
Nevada
New Mexico
Oregon State
San Diego State
San Jose State
UNLV
Utah State
Washington State
Wyoming
+ 1 More (SMU, UTEP, NMSU, anyone...)

BB/Olympic Sports Members:
Air Force
Boise State
Cal
Colorado State
Fresno State
Nevada
New Mexico
Oregon State
San Diego State
San Jose State
Stanford
UNLV
Utah State
Washington State
Wyoming
+1 More (SMU, UTEP, NMSU, anyone...)

Do they have that much value? They aren't Notre Dame, and that is a sincere question.
No, they definitely are not Notre Dame. But they most assuredly have more value than any current MWC school, or any other school that would conceivably be on the MWC radar.
I don't mean any dispargement to the Cardinal, in another thread I expressed bewilderment over a team with such a strong all around athletic program being left behind.

However, this is being driven by football and Stanford averages about 35,000 for their home games. They reduced the capacity of the stadium because of those woes. I am not sure whatever iteration of the Western football league comes will allow Stanford without FB only.

Do we add value? Our average is a lot less than that. Not sure if any MWC school averages more than 35,000.
Stanford has won more NCAA team championships than any other school in the country. They have 134 national championships in 20 sports. Plus they are a top 5 university globally. So, they bring plenty of value.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanfor ... mpionships

Would whatever league accept Stanford without football? I don't know the answer to that.

I agree they have a very strong all around athletic program, particularly in the Olympic sports. If USU was in the same league as them, I would be estatic. I don't have anything disparaging to say about them.

Bullnamed_gus · Post by **Bullnamed_gus** » August 4th, 2023, 11:25 am

This will never happen but I could dream lol

New Conference: Utah, Arizona State, Stanford, Cal, Oregon State, Washington State, San Diego State, Boise State, Utah State, Fresno State, UNLV, Colorado State, SMU, and Memphis.

14 Team Mountain PAC conference. Get it done

Aggie84025 · Post by **Aggie84025** » August 4th, 2023, 11:31 am

One thing is for certain is the MWC should be super aggressive right now. Being aggressive is what saved the BIG12 and lack of being aggressive is what killed the PAC12 (among other things). There is blood in the water and the MWC should be bold in taking advantage of it.

ustate98 · Post by **ustate98** » August 4th, 2023, 11:39 am

Send invites right away to all remaining PAC teams 5 minutes ago.

ratofallaggies · Post by **ratofallaggies** » August 4th, 2023, 11:45 am

Bullnamed_gus wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 11:25 am
This will never happen but I could dream lol

New Conference: Utah, Arizona State, Stanford, Cal, Oregon State, Washington State, San Diego State, Boise State, Utah State, Fresno State, UNLV, Colorado State, SMU, and Memphis.

14 Team Mountain PAC conference. Get it done

You're right, Gus. This wont happen. AZ, ASU, and Utah are already on their way out.

Cheecho6 · Post by **Cheecho6** » August 4th, 2023, 11:45 am

Hold the ranks and be aggressive MW! Now is the time to solidify the league. Get invites to all remaining PAC schools as well as top teams from the American.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Bullnamed_gus · Post by **Bullnamed_gus** » August 4th, 2023, 11:54 am

Fact of the matter is, getting pulled into the Oac 12 wouldn’t be awful. I’d probably prefer it over us taking them replacing the dead weight in our current conference with bigger names and fanbases would be much better. I don’t have any interest sharing a conference with New Mexico or
Wyoming, I’m sorry.

StanfordAggie · Post by **StanfordAggie** » August 4th, 2023, 12:54 pm

dogie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 7:27 am
Stanford has won more NCAA team championships than any other school in the country. They have 134 national championships in 20 sports. Plus they are a top 5 university globally. So, they bring plenty of value.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanfor ... mpionships

Yeah, if Stanford joined the MWC, realistically they would absolutely dominate the conference in every non-revenue sport. The rest of the conference would be competing for 2nd in all sports other than football and men's basketball. Since realistically you won't have a professional career outside of the two revenue sports, the prospect of earning a Stanford degree is irresistible to most recruits. Stanford pretty much recruits whoever they want, so they have a top-5 national ranking in almost every Olympic sport every year.

I suppose that would be good for the conference in principle. The MWC might end up with more national titles across the board than any other conference in the country. But it might hurt recruiting for the remaining MWC schools since they would never realistically compete for a conference title again.

Regardless, I think it is very doubtful that it happens. Maybe it is wishful thinking on my part, but I think the most likely scenario is that Stanford and Cal end up in the Big 10. The revenue hit they would take from joining the MWC or independence would be enormous, so my guess is that they would happily accept a partial revenue share from the B1G if that is what it took to get a life raft out of the PAC. If Stanford ended up losing at the game of conference musical chairs, most of the rumors I have heard have involved Stanford trying to form a new conference consisting of academically selective private schools (Duke, Wake Forest, Rice, Northwestern, Vanderbilt, etc.). It makes a certain amount sense. Most of these schools struggle to compete against much larger public schools in their current conferences. But I have a hard time seeing Northwestern and Vanderbilt taking that kind of a revenue hit, so this may be wishful thinking on Stanford's part. It will be interesting to see what happens. But I feel like Stanford in the MWC would be a very awkward marriage for everyone involved, so I have a hard time seeing it happening.

ustate98 · Post by **ustate98** » August 4th, 2023, 1:01 pm

I might be crazy but if I'm the B1G I'd prefer Florida State and Clemson over Cal and Stanford.

utaggies · Post by **utaggies** » August 4th, 2023, 1:07 pm

Why would P5 football also-rans leave their conferences and the teats of their sugar daddies to compete better in football and the minor sports? That’s not going to happen.

Stanford may elect to go indy but that also has its problems. I wonder what kind of hit Stanford’s minor sports programs will take when the media revenue is reduced by 75%. In spite of the size of their endowment it’s not being used for athletics unless it’s buildings.

LKGates · Post by **LKGates** » August 4th, 2023, 1:12 pm

utaggies wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 1:07 pm
Why would P5 football also-rans leave their conferences and the teats of their sugar daddies to compete better in football and the minor sports? That’s not going to happen.

Stanford may elect to go indy but that also has its problems. I wonder what kind of hit Stanford’s minor sports programs will take when the media revenue is reduced by 75%. In spite of the size of their endowment it’s not being used for athletics unless it’s buildings.

Stanford could take the recent BYU route, go indy in football, and park their Oly sports in the MWC, to balance out Hawaii. I'm sure the conference would be thrilled to have them. And yes, their Oly sports would probably decline over time in this arrangement. It might just be the least of several evils for them...

Slim80 · Post by **Slim80** » August 4th, 2023, 1:13 pm

ustate98 wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 1:01 pm
I might be crazy but if I'm the B1G I'd prefer Florida State and Clemson over Cal and Stanford.

I agree with you, but the SEC will have something to say about that.

AGGIEinIOWA · Post by **AGGIEinIOWA** » August 4th, 2023, 1:34 pm

Things will really unravel if the lawyers at FSU and Clemson find a way out of the ACC. I could see the SEC, B1G, and XII all grabbing teams to get to 20 each. Maybe this happens.

SEC adds: FSU, Clemson, GT, Miami
B1G adds: UNC, Va
XII adds: Duke, NCSU, VT, Pitt or maybe they grab Stanford.

WF, Loius, BC, Syr all left to merge with AAC maybe? UConn joins them?

Madmartigan · Post by **Madmartigan** » August 4th, 2023, 3:01 pm

StanfordAggie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 12:54 pm

dogie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 7:27 am
Stanford has won more NCAA team championships than any other school in the country. They have 134 national championships in 20 sports. Plus they are a top 5 university globally. So, they bring plenty of value.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanfor ... mpionships
Yeah, if Stanford joined the MWC, realistically they would absolutely dominate the conference in every non-revenue sport. The rest of the conference would be competing for 2nd in all sports other than football and men's basketball. Since realistically you won't have a professional career outside of the two revenue sports, the prospect of earning a Stanford degree is irresistible to most recruits. Stanford pretty much recruits whoever they want, so they have a top-5 national ranking in almost every Olympic sport every year.

I suppose that would be good for the conference in principle. The MWC might end up with more national titles across the board than any other conference in the country. But it might hurt recruiting for the remaining MWC schools since they would never realistically compete for a conference title again.

Regardless, I think it is very doubtful that it happens. Maybe it is wishful thinking on my part, but I think the most likely scenario is that Stanford and Cal end up in the Big 10. The revenue hit they would take from joining the MWC or independence would be enormous, so my guess is that they would happily accept a partial revenue share from the B1G if that is what it took to get a life raft out of the PAC. If Stanford ended up losing at the game of conference musical chairs, most of the rumors I have heard have involved Stanford trying to form a new conference consisting of academically selective private schools (Duke, Wake Forest, Rice, Northwestern, Vanderbilt, etc.). It makes a certain amount sense. Most of these schools struggle to compete against much larger public schools in their current conferences. But I have a hard time seeing Northwestern and Vanderbilt taking that kind of a revenue hit, so this may be wishful thinking on Stanford's part. It will be interesting to see what happens. But I feel like Stanford in the MWC would be a very awkward marriage for everyone involved, so I have a hard time seeing it happening.

One thing I'd like you to explain: Why does it always have to be Stanford AND Cal? They're both in the bay area and have great academics, but beyond that the similarities stop. Stanford has a lot of cash and Cal is saddled in debt. Neither would really carry the bay area market either.

Aggie84025 · Post by **Aggie84025** » August 4th, 2023, 3:24 pm

Scotty mentioned on 1280 that sources told him that Gloria had gotten the approval from MWC school presidents to start exploring options of expanding the conference.

StanfordAggie · Post by **StanfordAggie** » August 4th, 2023, 3:25 pm

Madmartigan wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 3:01 pm
One thing I'd like you to explain: Why does it always have to be Stanford AND Cal? They're both in the bay area and have great academics, but beyond that the similarities stop. Stanford has a lot of cash and Cal is saddled in debt. Neither would really carry the bay area market either.

Well, if I were going to make a pitch deck to sell Stanford/Cal to the B1G, it would go something like this:

1) Revenue: If Stanford and Cal were in the B1G, it would probably ensure that the BTN would be on basic cable in the Bay Area at the very least and probably the entire state of California. Even if neither school moves the dial at all in terms of TV ratings, that's still a huge amount of subscription fee revenue. Given that Stanford and Cal would almost certainly agree to only a partial share of TV revenue if it came to that, I'm sure that it would end up being a net positive for the BTN in terms of money.

2) Travel/Scheduling: Right now travel would be absolutely brutal for the non-revenue sports at USC/UCLA since their closest road game would be in Nebraska. It becomes vastly easier if you can schedule at least five road games on the West Coast.

3) Academics: Stanford and Cal are two of the top 5 universities in the country (if not the world) by any measure of faculty quality/research productivity. For a conference that prides itself on being the top academic conference outside of the Ivy League, that is a selling point.

As for why Cal and not just Stanford, I would add the following to each of the above points:

1) Stanford is a smaller private school with alumni scattered across the country. It's not clear that Bay Area cable companies would pay for the BTN just to show Stanford games. Cal has far more alumni than Stanford does, and they are concentrated in California, so it is a much easier sell if you have Cal as well.

2) Travel costs for the West Coast teams will be lower if they have five West Coast games rather than four. Likewise it will make scheduling easier for the eastern B1G teams if they can visit two nearby schools on each West Coast road trip.

3) Any conference will be stronger academically if Cal is included.

ratofallaggies · Post by **ratofallaggies** » August 4th, 2023, 3:33 pm

Aggie84025 wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 3:24 pm
Scotty mentioned on 1280 that sources told him that Gloria had gotten the approval from MWC school presidents to start exploring options of expanding the conference.

"exploring" is an interesting term. You could say that the MW has already been "exploring" for months now. So if that word means something new is now happening, it could mean something very interesting

Hoot · Post by **Hoot** » August 4th, 2023, 3:47 pm

ratofallaggies wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 3:33 pm

Aggie84025 wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 3:24 pm
Scotty mentioned on 1280 that sources told him that Gloria had gotten the approval from MWC school presidents to start exploring options of expanding the conference.
"exploring" is an interesting term. You could say that the MW has already been "exploring" for months now. So if that word means something new is now happening, it could mean something very interesting

Black Hills State is making the jump to D1 just a bit sooner then y’all were expecting.

cval · Post by **cval** » August 4th, 2023, 4:02 pm

ratofallaggies wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 3:33 pm

Aggie84025 wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 3:24 pm
Scotty mentioned on 1280 that sources told him that Gloria had gotten the approval from MWC school presidents to start exploring options of expanding the conference.
"exploring" is an interesting term. You could say that the MW has already been "exploring" for months now. So if that word means something new is now happening, it could mean something very interesting

Weasel words to maintain some semblance of plausible deniability.

Full · Post by **Full** » August 4th, 2023, 4:09 pm

I hate that the Civil War and Apple Cup are gone the way of the Battle of the Brothers. I just can’t have a lot of sympathy for the death of the PAC. I’ve been a fan of a team that has been left behind again and again, and no one mourned.

SwaggieAggie · Post by **SwaggieAggie** » August 4th, 2023, 4:23 pm

Full wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 4:09 pm
I hate that the Civil War and Apple Cup are gone the way of the Battle of the Brothers. I just can’t have a lot of sympathy for the death of the PAC. I’ve been a fan of a team that has been left behind again and again, and no one mourned.

True. Ain’t gonna find too much sympathy from G5 lifers.

I do find it funny hearing the overly-dramatic responses from fans and media about conference realignment leaving some Pac-12 members to “die” or “rot.” Like damn. It ain’t that terrible over here lol

DixieAggie · Post by **DixieAggie** » August 4th, 2023, 4:30 pm

dogie wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 9:11 am

flying_scotsman2.0 wrote: ↑
August 3rd, 2023, 8:24 am

Northwest
Washington State
Gonzaga
Oregon State
Boise State
Utah State

Pacific
SDSU
Fresno State
SJSU
Cal
Hawaii

Mountain
Wyoming
Colorado State
Air Force
Nevada
UNLV

South
New Mexico
Wichita State
SMU
Memphis
Tulane
The new PAC16 (PAC & MWC merger)
Northern Division
WSU, OSU, BSU, NEV, WYO, CSU, AFA, USU

Southern Division
FSU, SJSU, CAL, SDSU, UNLV, UNM, HAW, SMU - Invite SMU (IF CAL doesn't come invite UT San Antonio, TX market)

Add Gonzaga for Olympic sports (Hawaii football only)

NowhereLandAggie · Post by **NowhereLandAggie** » August 4th, 2023, 4:45 pm

StanfordAggie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 3:25 pm

Madmartigan wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 3:01 pm
One thing I'd like you to explain: Why does it always have to be Stanford AND Cal? They're both in the bay area and have great academics, but beyond that the similarities stop. Stanford has a lot of cash and Cal is saddled in debt. Neither would really carry the bay area market either.
Well, if I were going to make a pitch deck to sell Stanford/Cal to the B1G, it would go something like this:

1) Revenue: If Stanford and Cal were in the B1G, it would probably ensure that the BTN would be on basic cable in the Bay Area at the very least and probably the entire state of California. Even if neither school moves the dial at all in terms of TV ratings, that's still a huge amount of subscription fee revenue. Given that Stanford and Cal would almost certainly agree to only a partial share of TV revenue if it came to that, I'm sure that it would end up being a net positive for the BTN in terms of money.

2) Travel/Scheduling: Right now travel would be absolutely brutal for the non-revenue sports at USC/UCLA since their closest road game would be in Nebraska. It becomes vastly easier if you can schedule at least five road games on the West Coast.

3) Academics: Stanford and Cal are two of the top 5 universities in the country (if not the world) by any measure of faculty quality/research productivity. For a conference that prides itself on being the top academic conference outside of the Ivy League, that is a selling point.

As for why Cal and not just Stanford, I would add the following to each of the above points:

1) Stanford is a smaller private school with alumni scattered across the country. It's not clear that Bay Area cable companies would pay for the BTN just to show Stanford games. Cal has far more alumni than Stanford does, and they are concentrated in California, so it is a much easier sell if you have Cal as well.

2) Travel costs for the West Coast teams will be lower if they have five West Coast games rather than four. Likewise it will make scheduling easier for the eastern B1G teams if they can visit two nearby schools on each West Coast road trip.

3) Any conference will be stronger academically if Cal is included.

I am certain those points have been made. The B1G just isn't interested, at least right now.

I really don't know what those schools do, particularly Cal. It will be interesting to see.

StanfordAggie · Post by **StanfordAggie** » August 4th, 2023, 4:49 pm

NowhereLandAggie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 4:45 pm

StanfordAggie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 3:25 pm

Madmartigan wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 3:01 pm
One thing I'd like you to explain: Why does it always have to be Stanford AND Cal? They're both in the bay area and have great academics, but beyond that the similarities stop. Stanford has a lot of cash and Cal is saddled in debt. Neither would really carry the bay area market either.
Well, if I were going to make a pitch deck to sell Stanford/Cal to the B1G, it would go something like this:

1) Revenue: If Stanford and Cal were in the B1G, it would probably ensure that the BTN would be on basic cable in the Bay Area at the very least and probably the entire state of California. Even if neither school moves the dial at all in terms of TV ratings, that's still a huge amount of subscription fee revenue. Given that Stanford and Cal would almost certainly agree to only a partial share of TV revenue if it came to that, I'm sure that it would end up being a net positive for the BTN in terms of money.

2) Travel/Scheduling: Right now travel would be absolutely brutal for the non-revenue sports at USC/UCLA since their closest road game would be in Nebraska. It becomes vastly easier if you can schedule at least five road games on the West Coast.

3) Academics: Stanford and Cal are two of the top 5 universities in the country (if not the world) by any measure of faculty quality/research productivity. For a conference that prides itself on being the top academic conference outside of the Ivy League, that is a selling point.

As for why Cal and not just Stanford, I would add the following to each of the above points:

1) Stanford is a smaller private school with alumni scattered across the country. It's not clear that Bay Area cable companies would pay for the BTN just to show Stanford games. Cal has far more alumni than Stanford does, and they are concentrated in California, so it is a much easier sell if you have Cal as well.

2) Travel costs for the West Coast teams will be lower if they have five West Coast games rather than four. Likewise it will make scheduling easier for the eastern B1G teams if they can visit two nearby schools on each West Coast road trip.

3) Any conference will be stronger academically if Cal is included.
I am certain those points have been made. The B1G just isn't interested, at least right now.

I really don't know what those schools do, particularly Cal. It will be interesting to see.

The report I read said that the B1G is interested but their TV partners are more hesitant. I'm hoping that they simply haven't run the numbers yet and that invites to Stanford and Cal will go out once they do, assuming the numbers are favorable. If they aren't, then Stanford and Cal negotiate for a smaller revenue share. Maybe it's just wishful thinking, but I have a hard time believing that those two schools are just going to rot on the vine. (I wonder if the Big 12 might be interested if the B1G passes.)

Post by **GeoAg** » August 4th, 2023, 4:53 pm

StanfordAggie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 4:49 pm

NowhereLandAggie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 4:45 pm

StanfordAggie wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 3:25 pm

Madmartigan wrote: ↑
August 4th, 2023, 3:01 pm
One thing I'd like you to explain: Why does it always have to be Stanford AND Cal? They're both in the bay area and have great academics, but beyond that the similarities stop. Stanford has a lot of cash and Cal is saddled in debt. Neither would really carry the bay area market either.
Well, if I were going to make a pitch deck to sell Stanford/Cal to the B1G, it would go something like this:

1) Revenue: If Stanford and Cal were in the B1G, it would probably ensure that the BTN would be on basic cable in the Bay Area at the very least and probably the entire state of California. Even if neither school moves the dial at all in terms of TV ratings, that's still a huge amount of subscription fee revenue. Given that Stanford and Cal would almost certainly agree to only a partial share of TV revenue if it came to that, I'm sure that it would end up being a net positive for the BTN in terms of money.

2) Travel/Scheduling: Right now travel would be absolutely brutal for the non-revenue sports at USC/UCLA since their closest road game would be in Nebraska. It becomes vastly easier if you can schedule at least five road games on the West Coast.

3) Academics: Stanford and Cal are two of the top 5 universities in the country (if not the world) by any measure of faculty quality/research productivity. For a conference that prides itself on being the top academic conference outside of the Ivy League, that is a selling point.

As for why Cal and not just Stanford, I would add the following to each of the above points:

1) Stanford is a smaller private school with alumni scattered across the country. It's not clear that Bay Area cable companies would pay for the BTN just to show Stanford games. Cal has far more alumni than Stanford does, and they are concentrated in California, so it is a much easier sell if you have Cal as well.

2) Travel costs for the West Coast teams will be lower if they have five West Coast games rather than four. Likewise it will make scheduling easier for the eastern B1G teams if they can visit two nearby schools on each West Coast road trip.

3) Any conference will be stronger academically if Cal is included.
I am certain those points have been made. The B1G just isn't interested, at least right now.

I really don't know what those schools do, particularly Cal. It will be interesting to see.
The report I read said that the B1G is interested but their TV partners are more hesitant. I'm hoping that they simply haven't run the numbers yet and that invites to Stanford and Cal will go out once they do, assuming the numbers are favorable. If they aren't, then Stanford and Cal negotiate for a smaller revenue share. Maybe it's just wishful thinking, but I have a hard time believing that those two schools are just going to rot on the vine. (I wonder if the Big 12 might be interested if the B1G passes.)

If they were interested they would have taken them today and added the #10 market in the country. Instead they took schools in markets they already owned. Their band and the market weren't enough to get in. I hope to see them I'm the MWC. Great schools, just not good enough in what matters for conference realignment.

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